Tue 23 Aug 2005
Learning about different religions can be quite an interesting study. I find it fascinating how people of different religions can think they believe similar things when they really don’t. They may use the same word “god”, but it means entirely different things to each group. Even within different faiths, people may have different interpretations of the same scripture and have different views about what is true and what is false. This is something that has always interested me, but I’ve never truly taken the time to study each religion in-depth.
This past Sunday, I was visiting The Rock Church in San Diego. The pastor, Miles McPherson, is going through series called “True Religion?”, where he looks at different faiths and compares them to Christianity. This past Sunday, he took a look at Islam. From my travels to Egypt, I have discovered that Islam and the Arabic language are very well meshed together. The Arabic word for god is allah. Now, the name of the Muslim god is Allah. Yet, I met Christians who believe in God and Jesus. They still used the word “Allah” for God even though the Christian God and Muslim god are not the same. It can be a bit confusing for people who don’t speak Arabic and frustrating for Christians that do. One Christian man our group met was frustrated that Americans say that Allah is bad. Yet, Allah is Jehovah God for Christians in Egypt. People need to realize what the difference is between the word allah.
What I learned about the Muslim god, Allah, and the Christian God, Jehovah, was quite eye opening. Some things that really stood out to me were:
1. Many years ago, Allah was one god of many supposed gods. Mohammed chose Allah as the one god of Islam. Yet, Allah was a pagan god before Mohammed chose him. Allah was the Moon God. It is also interesting that the Islamic symbol is a moon.
2. Allah is one god while Lord God, Jehovah, is a Trinity. Miles said that Muslims think that the fact that Christians have the Trinity causes them to believe that Christianity is a polytheistic religion (the belief in more than one god). The Quran states “God has not taken to Himself any son, nor is there any god with Him: For then each god would have taken of that which he created and some of them would have risen up over others.” That is far from the truth, to those of us who are Christians. God is the Father, Son and Holy Spirit in one. Each part of the Trinity has a different function, but they are one in the same.
3. Then, there are the differences between the Muslim Allah and Jehovah God. Jesus came to Earth and died for us. He was tempted in all the things that we are tempted in, yet He did not give in to those temptations. Thus, he can relate to what we’re going through, but is our ultimate example of not giving into sin. Yet, Allah in the Muslim faith is so high above people that he cannot relate to his followers. He is not sympathetic to them because he has never come to Earth and does not suffer for them. Instead, Muslims suffer for Allah. Even though Allah is referred to in the Quran, “In the name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate.”, there is at least one thing which Allah cannot ever forgive. It is stated that “Islam considers associating any deity or personality with God as a deadly sin which God will never forgive, despite the fact He may forgive all other sins.” Jehovah God will always forgive every sin, if the person truly comes to Him, repents and ask for forgiveness. God knows our hearts, minds and souls. He knows when we truly mean what we say and He will forgive those who truly want His forgiveness, no matter what they have done.
4. Muslims are servants to Allah and Christians are God’s children. Muslims are there to submit to Allah and to do what he says. Even getting into Heaven is a difficult task for Muslims. Where Christians follow God, believe in God and Jesus’ sacrifice, love Him and leave their old lives of sin for God in order to have eternal life in Heaven, Muslims must have more good deeds in life in order to outweigh the bad. They believe that once they die, they are judged and if they have performed more good deeds than bad, they can get into heaven. If there are more bad deeds, they cannot. To me, that’s a scary thought. I am far from perfect and am so glad that Jesus died on the cross and took upon Himself the punishment for all of the sins I have committed and will commit in my life. God doesn’t want His children to suffer. He loves us so much that He cannot bear to see people not coming to Him. That is why His invitation is always open to us to come to Him. If we come to Him, believe that God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are who they say they are, and leave our old, sinful lives behind, we’re on our way to Heaven. We only need to do that once and we’re in. Our salvation cannot be taken away from us. We are all ultimately judged after death and pastors are held to a higher standard because they are leading the Christian “flock”, but those of us who are Christians will all be in Heaven together and worshipping God. There is no fear involved if you are a true believer. Romans 10:9-13 says
“That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame. For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
5. Knowledge of God is a wonderful part of the Christian faith. To know God is to be in relationship with Him. Jehovah God already knows us intimately and loves us greatly. He knows what we’re thinking and saying even before it is thought or said. He also wants us to know Him intimately. In order to do that, He gives us the Holy Bible, which reveals who He is and what His will is for us. It also tells us about the life of Jesus, whom we look to as our perfect example. We also have prayer, where we talk to God and He can also speak to us if we are willing to listen. We also have other Christian believers to point us to the Truth of God’s Word. It is so wonderful to know other, wiser Christians. We can learn so much from one another because some of us have experienced different things in life and we can share with eachother. On the flip side, Allah is unknowable. All that is really known is “That you may know that Allah is able to do all things, and that Allah knows all things.” It is believed that Allah is seated on his throne above the Earth and is looking down on everything. Thus, he knows it all, but it’s hard to know about him.
6. Allah’s love is earned while Jehovah’s love is received. Allah loves those who obey him and hates the sinner. Jehovah God loves the sinner. Since the fall of Adam and Eve, there is no way for us to be perfect, so we are all sinners. Yet, Jesus still came to Earth to die for sinners because God loves us. Since God loves us, He wants us to love Him as well. Yet, our love must be genuine. We cannot love God because we want something from Him or want to avoid going to Hell. It doesn’t work that way. He knows what we’re thinking and we can’t trick Him. Love for God is a mutual thing. He always loved us, even before we were created because we are His children. God gives us the opportunity to love Him in return and we are never prevented from doing so. Romans 5:8 says
“But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.”
Jesus’ death gave us the greatest gift we could ever ask for. He gave us eternal life and prevented us from obtaining the wrath that our sin deserves.
I find this all quite fascinating. I want to look into this a bit more, when I have the time. I also want to check out other religions to see what they believe. I think it’s important for Christians to know what they believe themselves, but also know what other religions believe. That way, we can know where we differ instead of believing that we believe altered versions of the same thing. There’s a great book called What Christians Believe by David Hocking. It’s focuses on the basics of Christianity. The 6 chapters cover how we know the Bible is Truth, who God is , who Jesus is, the Holy Spirit, what salvation is, and the second coming of Christ. Of course, nothing can ever cover those truths better than the Bible. So, getting into the Word on a regular basis is key. I need to do the same myself, perhaps right now.
September 10th, 2005 at 7:50 pm
Here’s a little bit of advice for you….next time you want to go posting stuff about Islam…get your facts straight. More than half the stuff you posted up is bs. You really want to compare Christianity to Islam? Are you really THAT interested in it? Then go, with an open mind, to someone who knows what they’re talking about and find out what Islam’s really about. Don’t go trying to interpret Islam the way you want to and think you’re correct in doing so. Islam is not, at all, what you’re trying to make it seem. Don’t go trying to prove that Christianity is better than Islam by stating false information…it only shows how ignorant you really are.
September 11th, 2005 at 8:38 pm
I encourage anyone who has information to share about Islam and about the Muslim view of Christianity in order to expand my knowledge on the subject. I did a bit of research as I wrote this blog straight from Islamic run sites. I would really appreciate more comments about what Muslims believe.
September 15th, 2005 at 2:42 pm
Hey, I came across your site via Dustin’s site. I have been enjoying his site for the last couple of days, and yes he is an awesome web developer.
You’ve got some neat posts on your site, and this one in particular was of interest due to the fact that I grew up in Lebanon, and also lived in Egypt for a year and a half. My Dad still lives in Egypt. I’ve been to “Garbage City” that you mention in your About Me page and it is a life changing experience. I’m a full-blooded American Caucasian btw.
Anyhow, on the topic of Islam vs. Christianity, I think that Christians have a lot of misconceptions about Islam, just like Muslims abroad have many misconceptions and stereotypes about Christians. Many of them can’t get past the Crusader days, even though they don’t realize that the Crusaders weren’t true Christians. It’s probably a lot like the way that the Al Qaeda does not represent most Muslims.
I agree with you that we need more dialog and discussion about what both sides believe. I can say from my experience having lived among Muslims and in Muslim countries, that in general Muslims are very closed minded to learning about Christianity and are very threatened by those that try to discuss Christianity with them. Unlike the U.S. and most western countries, it is illegal to evangelize/proseletize as a Chritian in a Muslim country (you often get thrown in jail or kicked out of the country), even though the official government position may state otherwise. As you know, in Egypt, they officially say they are a democratic country and while there is a sizeable Coptic Christian minority, the Muslim majority rules with a very heavy hand.
Lastly, I’ve always said that if Muslims think that they have the TRUTH, why are they so afraid to discuss religion with Christians and why are they afraid to let Christians evangelize and discuss Christianity in their countries. In the U.S. we allow people of any religious affiliation to voice their views freely and as Christians we are not threatened by it since we believe that we have THE TRUTH. I’m not threatened by Mormons or Jehova’s Witnesses or Scientologists, because I know that at the end of the day the TRUTH will win out, and if Christianity is really the TRUTH, then the debate will just stengthen my faith. Does that make sense.
Anyhow, I’ve really enjoyed your site and your thoughts, and if you want to contact me offline, feel free to email me.
September 24th, 2005 at 4:26 am
Hey after reading this information i would have to hightly agree with marium about the subject because half the things you said about islam is not true. I myself is a christain and i would have to disgree with your comments in regards to islam, especially as you stated that allah is not forgiving, hence it clearly repeated states in the quaran that allah is most forgiving, most merciful. An in regards to steve’s comment it is not true that muslems are not open minded to christaintiy as in order to believe in islam, you MUST believe in the three books, quaran, old jewish and christian testimine. I just believe that if ever publish information on the net, espeicially in relation to religion, come in with an open mind. Muslems are just ordinary people. Its stupid how in todays society people are judged by their relgion, or other things.. We are all the same. God or allah loves each and every one of us.
September 24th, 2005 at 9:45 am
Thank you for your comment, Carina. In regard to Islam believing the Christian Bible and Jewish Torah, your statement is not correct. Muslims believe that parts of the Gospels, Torah and Jewish prophetic books have been forgotten, misinterpreted, or distorted by their followers. With that perspective, Muslims view the Qur’an as corrective of Jewish and Christian scriptures. If Muslims did believe entirely in the Bible, they would also believe that Jesus was not just a prophet, but the Savior of the world and the Son of God.
I would agree that we are all the same as God’s creatures, but as a Christian, I would hope that you would also realize that all religions are NOT the same. As a Christian, I know that only the death and resurrection of Jesus is able to provide salvation and eternal life. As a Christian, I know that by believing that all religions are true, I am withholding information to unbelievers about all that God has done for us and the way of salvation, which can only be obtained through belief and submission to Jesus Christ. I can come with an open mind to understand other religions, but that does not mean that I would follow them because I know the truth of Christianity.
Again, I would encourage anyone to show me what Muslims truly believe.
October 17th, 2005 at 3:44 pm
First of all, it is important to note that “Allah” is the same word that Arabic-speaking Christians and Jews use for God. If you pick up an Arabic Bible, you will see the word “Allah” being used where “God” is used in English. This is because “Allah” is the only word in the Arabic language equivalent to the English word “God” with a capital “G”. Additionally, the word “Allah” cannot be made plural or given gender (i.e. masculine or feminine), which goes hand-in-hand with the Islamic concept of God. Because of this, and also because the Qur’an, which is the holy scripture of Muslims, was revealed in the Arabic language, some Muslims use the word “Allah” for “God”, even when they are speaking other languages. This is not unique to the word “Allah”, since many Muslims tend to use Arabic words when discussing Islamic issues, regardless of the language which they speak. This is because the universal teachings of Islam - even though they have been translated in every major language - have been preserved in the Arabic language. -Abu Iman Abd ar-Rahman Robert Squires
November 3rd, 2005 at 10:29 am
Hey Stephanie I liked what all you said, and the caring and patient attitude you had toward all the responses. It’s interesting I came across this site. I just got out of my cultural geography class where we listened to a muslim woman’s lecture about Islam. I’ve also been reading a book about Islam in which the author himself used to be a shiite muslim who became a Christian. He talks of how he felt no love in the religion of Islam. He did say though, that there are those muslims that are extremely nice, and do good things for people; they aren’t all terrorists like the world seems to think. Yet, the god that they serve isn’t always “loving” like he is made out to be. Even the Muslim woman this morning said that if you commit a bad sin, then her god Allah does not love you. So if there is such love in Islam, it is only conditional. I am not writing this to put down others for their beliefs or to be “mean” or whatever; I think Christianity has gotten a bad name because of those that have been “over zealous” if you will. Christ commands us to love others, even our enemies, even those that we don’t agree with. Therefore, I’m not bashing muslims. It was just hard for me to sit through the lecture as she talked as though God was the muslim god Allah. I then asked her, “If it is true that we have the same God, then why is Muhammad not mentioned in the Holy Bible?” She said that he is, but under another name. I also asked her why Jesus Christ is the Son of God and Savior of the world in the Holy Bible, and in the Qu’ran He is only a prophet. Seems contradictory to me. I know my Bible is infallible, so it’s not my Bible that is mistaken. Once again, I’m not bashing other religions, I just know that Jesus Christ is Lord and there is no other God. I do have an honest question for any Muslim that would like to reply, why does your Allah have people die for him, and yet in Christianity, it is clear that Christ came and died for us. Also, Christ came for us. He felt the pain of being a human, He became flesh, dwelt among us, lived around us, and yet never sinned because He was the plan for salvation. Yet, He was able to have true compassion on us because He knew how we suffered at times. He himself cried over the loss of a loved one, and even weeped over a whole city because of the horrible condition it was in. Did your Allah come to earth, what has He done for YOU to make a way to heaven…anything? Or is it all up to you.
November 10th, 2005 at 11:13 am
From the movie “The Graduate” and P. Simons “Mrs Robinson”
Heres to you Mrs Robinson, Jesus loves you more than you will know…
Heaven holds a place for those who pray…
Most of all you’ve got to hide it from the kids.
According to “Christianity”, all you have to do to enter heaven is
confess (your sins) before you die.
It is my Presbyterian upbringing that interprets Calvin by:
The Good Life is its own reward.
What is your interpretation of:
The meek shall inherit the Earth.
Does it mean that:
The meek shall not inherit (go to) heaven, and are condemmed to the grave?
or
The meek shall go to heaven?
or
The meek are not strong enough to gain entrance by their works?
On to the Gloria Patra (Oath):
I believe in God the father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth, and
in Jesus Christ his only son our lord,
who was born of the virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilot, and
was crucified, dead and buried.
I believe in the holy catholic church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins, and
the life everlasting - amen.
Well, my take is o.k., but virgin mary sounds like the Vestal Virgins of Roman pantheism.
I don’t believe in any “holy” human (common) institutions/church/synagos/mosque. (Moses hears “You are on holy ground, my name is I am”).
I don’t believe in saints, but communion of apostles would be less Chatholic.
I believe Religion is a personal experience, enhanced by music and audiance participation.
It is not an institution, governance, rules, or anything else that seperates people into “camps”.
There has been a lot of past Violence caused by:
Divine Right of Kings,
Slavery & Empire
Religious Wars - Childrens Crusade,
“Merchant of Venice” - Only Jewish lenders could operate as bankers
Slavery did not end after the Civil War.
Holocaust - 20 century of Violence, but somehow Bankers are Christians.
Slavery is still with us (Children, Prostitution)
The only way to Peace is Love.
“Love is all you need” - Beatles (J. Lennon)
Peace and love require Compassion, Respect and Courage.
December 5th, 2005 at 1:11 pm
It’s important to remember that Muslims will consistently claim they believe in the same God as Chrsistians do, when they in fact do not. You cannot take parts of the Bible because they support your position (or you think they do) and leave others out.
This is akin to saying “I’ll take letters c-m for the English language, but not the rest.” The Bible stands as a whole, as the complete revealed plan of the ages for the Body of Christ and Israel until God is all in all. (1 Cor. 15)
Nor do they “believe in Jesus” as some claim. The Lord Jesus claimed to be exactly who he was - he never claimed to be merely a man or a “good servant” or merely a “prophet.” This is denial of His very recorded words.
What sets apart Christianity? It is a resurrected Savior - it is that simple. All religions offer a “heaven” of some sort, but none fully deal with the question of sin and death. See, you are going to DIE - this is a fact. Worms are going to feast on your body.
What hope have you then? We look to a resurrected savior - one who came back from the dead. When God speaks of his mighty power, he does not speak of creation - this was the “work of his fingers” so to speak. But in Ephesians resurrection is his MIGHTY power at work. To go beyond death and make the dead living is something nobody but the true God can do.
As Christians, we have a sure hope of resurrection. This is God’s grace - his free gift to all who will believe, and it is that same blood that delivers us from both the penalty and the bondage of sin. We are both forgiven AND justified - and this is very inmportant!
As Stephanie posted - God himself died for the UNgodly - us - so we could live. This is God’s unsearchable gift. Receive it!
What does Islam offer? Certainly not a savior. The only question that matters is what will you do with sin and death?
There is only one who can deliver you.
Tom
December 7th, 2005 at 4:36 pm
Hey Tom I liked what you said! Praise God we serve the Risen Savior! Keep on serving the Lord. = )
December 10th, 2005 at 12:52 am
I used to go to Miles McPhersons sermons at SDSU. Hence, I used to be a Christian. I have nothing against christians, but found out there are many ways to discredit trinity and God sending his son to die for our sins. Many times in the bible, the followers of monotheism who repented of their sins and strived to live a righteous life will receive their reward in the hereafter. In the old testament, you need not to be jewish or be Hebrew to attain salvation; the jews main purpose was to spread recognition of the one and only God, that is Yahweh (aka HaShem, Elohim, and yes, even Allah). It seems unfair for God to suddenly kill his “son” and tell people to beleive in the son as the only salvation. If he was suppose to be the sacrificial “lamb,” it seems inappropriate because in the torah, the sacrificial animal must be without blemish and wounds- the death should be quick and humane. Yet JESUS in the newtestament was treated very inhumane. Also, Jesus stated that “Why call me good? Only GOD is good!”
December 10th, 2005 at 1:03 am
BTW, the name God came from the germanic pagan diety “Got.” The word for God in spanish is “Dios”, which originated from the pagan diety, “Theo”
The death through salvation concept came from old paganism from Persia which spread throughout the Roman Empire, India, and western China; Mithraism.
http://www.vetssweatshop.net/dogma.htm
December 10th, 2005 at 1:43 am
Hi Tom…
Thank you for taking the time to come to my blog and leave your comment. In response to your comment, I do believe that Jesus was the perfect sacrificial lamb. Even sacrificial animals in the Torah were killed to atone for sins. They could not have been killed without causing a blemish. Jesus was the only perfect person who lived on this Earth because he is 100% man and 100% God. Thus, He was without blemish or wounds until He gave His life up for all of us. I highly doubt that the Roman soldiers overseeing His death were treating the entire situation as a sacrifice, so they weren’t following all the Jewish procedures, but I don’t think the result is any different from a sacrifice. Jesus died for our sins.
You stated that it was “unfair” for God to kill Jesus. In reality, what is unfair? Jesus willingly gave His life. The reason He was sent to Earth was to take on the punishment that we deserve for all the sins we have committed or will ever commit. As a result, those of us who believe are saved from Hell and the punishment for our sins. I don’t see it as unfair at all unless you consider how sinful we are. Is it unfair that God loves us so much that He is willing to sacrifice His own Son to save us? No. Yet, it is unfair that we try to be so independent and self-serving that we oftentimes ignore God and all that He has done for us. We rarely give God the praise and credit that He deserves in our lives. God is not unfair to us. We are the ones who are unfair to God. Romans 3:25-26 says “God presented Him (Jesus) as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in His blood. He did this to demonstrate His justice, because in His forebearance He had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished- He did it to demonstrate His justice at the present time, so as to be just and the One who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.”
Finally, you asked about the following verse: “Also, Jesus stated that “Why call me good? Only GOD is good!— This is a very good question and we must look at the words and the context. In Mark 10:18, a man ran up to Jesus and called Him “good teacher”. Jesus’ statement helps point out that Jesus is God. Why did the man call Jesus good when only God is good? Because Jesus is God. Jesus was pointing out who He is. Perhaps the man realized that Jesus is God and that is why He called him good, but Jesus was pointing out that the word “good” is used when referring to God. Therefore, the man spoke correctly.
Romans 3:10 says “There is no one righteous, not even one.” This passage is referring to us. None of us are good or righteous. We are not worthy of the gift God gave us by sending Jesus. Verse 21-24 of Romans 3 says “But now a righteousness from God apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace through the redeption that came by Christ Jesus.”
Jesus was and is the perfect sacrifice. We don’t deserve God’s love, but He gives it to us willingly and at all times as He waits for us to realize who He is and how much we need Him. God is fair and just. It is us who gain much by turning from our old lives of sin in order to pursue new lives through Christ. All we need to do is come to Him and allow Jesus to bridge the gap that stands between us and God due to our sins.
December 11th, 2005 at 4:43 pm
Do not argue with the people of the scripture (Jews, Christians, and Muslims) except in the nicest possible manner - unless they transgress - and say, “We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is one and the same; to Him we are
submitters.”
and tke a look on some stuff i wrote stephanie and u might get urself some answers
God Vs Allah : http://www.oneforum.org/showthread.php?t=9625
†he begining :
http://www.oneforum.org/showthread.php?t=9620
JESUS †he “SON” of GOD :
http://www.oneforum.org/showthread.php?t=9621
December 15th, 2005 at 10:31 am
How could people say that the God of Islam and the God of Christians aren’t the same God. Both the Quaran and the Bible states that God forgives and is merciful. But there are several instances in both books where God did not seem merciful…
Let me point out this website about the Cresent and the Moon. Please do a search and find out where the Prophet taught Muslim that this is the symbol of Islam…
http://islam.about.com/library/weekly/aa060401a.htm
According to Islam God has 99 names (some consider there to be more names that just weren’t reveal)
http://islam.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.jannah.org/articles/names.html
Website about the cross
http://www.thewordsofeternallife.com/cross.html
I change my religion from Catholic to Islam b/c I believe God is forgiving and merciful, hence the death of Jesus and baptizing was not needed (I can only account for my sins and not for my sisters, brothers, mom, uncle or the world). I still believe there is some truth in the bible.
There is a whole lot of closed-minded people in this world. Just the other day I simply asked a Christian (I think Baptist) about her faith and how a Baptist practice differ from a Catholic only to get a really rude answer.
Overall God is very forgiving…Just b/c you got one person’s opinion doesn’t mean that is what the religion is…Just recently my mom asked a muslim man who works with her about eating pork and he said it is ok for a muslim to eat it…When religious documents clearly says not to eat pork. Some women believe that the quran states to cover the whole body the whole body while others don’t believe that the quran stated that. That is just one person belief.
Forgiveness In Islam
“To receive forgiveness from God there are three requirements:
(1) Recognizing the offense itself and its admission before God.
(2) Making a commitment not to repeat the offense.
(3) Asking for forgiveness from God.
If the above three conditions are met in sincerity, forgiveness from God is assured. Sincerity protects a person from repeating the same offense. If a person is sincere he will be helped by God not to repeat; in addition, God will change his punishment for the offense into a reward.”
http://www.iiie.net/Articles/Forgiveness.html
December 15th, 2005 at 2:02 pm
Interesting topic…how ever…I find one point to be untrue…The Moon and Star symbol aren’t part of the religion of Islam itself it was adopted years later like the cross was(it was not adopted until after Jesus’ death, the cross also has pagan beliefs attached to it, I don’t celebrate many of the holidays, like Christmas b/c of the pagan beliefs associated with it). I also find many points to be untrue, however, those are your beliefs. Comparing two very different beliefs is like comparing American culture to a tribal culture…But good try though.
December 17th, 2005 at 10:09 am
Islam is submission to God The creator of all, the all mighty one and only. It is not important to a Muslim the comparison of gods, we know our God is the creator owner of the heavens and earth all hearing all knowing all seeing, one and only. If Christians choose to believe a god made of three or a god is a man that walked the earth, they should be wondering what they are worshiping! ! the information you have is false and irrelevant, you sound like you are making it up. Get your facts
December 17th, 2005 at 5:00 pm
I believe that the Bible, Koran and Torah each solve a certain piece. Christians know the real Jesus. Muslims know the real Mohammed and the Jewish know teh real moses and other prophets. So my point is Muslims shouldn’t go saying there is no Trinity when the bible was at the time of Jesus not 600 years later. Christians should not say that Mohammed didn’t exist because they believe Jesus was the last teacher of God. There are a whole lot of points where Muslims,Jews and Christians should not disagree and vice versa.
Muslims are like any other people they are not terroists and are not freaks.
I still belive as Christianity grows in certain Islam countries like Iran and Iraq there should be no persecutions just because a Islam decided to convert to Christianity there should be freedom.
This is usually why Muslims are considered different.
December 19th, 2005 at 10:06 pm
Dear James…
Thank you for your comment and for taking the time to
read my blog. Christianity is also a submission to
God, the Creator of all, the all knowing and the all
powerful. Yet, we also believe in Jesus, unlike Islam.
We do not believe that the Trinity is 3 gods, thus we
are not worshipping more than one god. We believe in
the Bible and know that from the beginning, the
Trinity existed. Just as water can be in 3 forms
(liquid, gas and solid), we believe that God can do
anything He desires. He can be in 3 forms, but One
God.
You stated “the
> information you have is false and irrelevant, you
> sound like you are making it up. Get your facts”
I would like to encourage you to point out which
facts you believe are false and show me how they are
so instead of making a blanket statement. I would
truly like to hear your thoughts.
December 19th, 2005 at 10:07 pm
David…
Thank you for taking the time to visit my blog
and leave your comment. I appreciate hearing the
opinions of others. From your response, it sounds like
you do not prescribe to any certain religion. Am I
assuming correctly or incorrectly?
As a Christian, I do prescribe to the teachings
of Christianity only. That is not to say that other
religions cannot do good things. Even people who are
athiests can do good things. What matters is where
they are going after they die. For me, it is much too
confusing to believe in multiple religions because
they go against one another in certain areas. So, how
do you know what to truly believe in?
I, too, believe that Muslims are not terrorists.
There are always bad apples within every society. It
is a pity that Islam has taken the wrap for so much
violence and am glad that some Islamic groups in the
U.S. and elsewhere are taking a stand against
terrorism. I also believe that Christianity can grow
fervantly in Islamic countries. I have seen that first
hand in Cairo, Egypt. Plus, one of the countries where
Christianity is growning the fastest is in China.
Amazing!
I do believe that Mohammed was a man. I do not
believe that he was a prophet of God. Just as I do not
believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet, as Mormons
do. Christians do know Moses and the other prophets,
but we also realized (unlike Jews), that the Messiah
has come. He came in the form of Jesus Christ and died
to take the penalty of everyone’s sins upon Himself,
so we wouldn’t have to. For me, that shows the true
love of God. I did not ask for Jesus to die, but He
did so willingly and that is why He came to Earth.
Jews were looking for a literal king who would wear a
crown, be born into wealth and so forth. They did not
see that Jesus was a king in His own right. When He
comes again to set up His kingdom, everyone will see
the Truth.
Thanks again and if you have any more comments,
feel free to send them my way.
December 19th, 2005 at 10:10 pm
The following is another email from Tomas:
I do believe that Jesus was the perfect sacrificial
lamb. Even sacrificial animals in the Torah were
killed to atone for sins. They could not have been
killed without causing a blemish. Jesus was the only
perfect person who lived on this Earth because he is
100% man and 100% God. Thus, He was without blemish or
wounds until He gave His life up for all of us. I
highly doubt that the Roman soldiers overseeing His
death were treating the entire situation as a
sacrifice, so they weren’t following all the Jewish
procedures, but I don’t think the result is any
different from a sacrifice. Jesus died for our sins.
Why wasnt this reiterated time and time again throughout the old testament. A huge event like this would have caused the prophets of israel to constantly remind the israelites about the coming saviour.
You stated that it was “unfair” for God to kill Jesus.
In reality, what is unfair? Jesus willingly gave His
life. The reason He was sent to Earth was to take on
the punishment that we deserve for all the sins we
have committed or will ever commit. As a result, those
of us who believe are saved from Hell and the
punishment for our sins. I don’t see it as unfair at
all unless you consider how sinful we are. Is it
unfair that God loves us so much that He is willing to
sacrifice His own Son to save us? No. Yet, it is
unfair that we try to be so independent and
self-serving that we oftentimes ignore God and all
that He has done for us. We rarely give God the praise
and credit that He deserves in our lives. God is not
unfair. We are the ones who are. Romans 3:25-26 says
“God presented Him (Jesus) as a sacrifice of
atonement, through faith in His blood. He did this to
demonstrate His justice, because in His forebearance
He had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished-
He did it to demonstrate His justice at the present
time, so as to be just and the One who justifies those
who have faith in Jesus.”
I believe it is unfair because during the time of jesus’s death, many jews and gentiles who believed and worshiped the true God that lived throughout the roman empire or beyond would not have received the gospel in time to attain salvation through Christ. Also the jewish messiah was suppose to come a bring world peace; its been 2005 years since the death and resurrection of Christ, no world peace. And where was the second coming of christ mentioned in the old testament and 4 gospels?
Finally, you asked about the following verse: “Also,
Jesus stated that “Why call me good? Only GOD is
good!”" This is a very good question and we must look
at the words and the context. In Mark 10:18, a man ran
up to Jesus and called Him “good teacher”. Jesus’
statement helps point out that Jesus is God. Why did
the man call Jesus good when only God is good? Because
Jesus is God. Jesus was pointing out who He is.
Perhaps the man realized that Jesus is God and that is
why He called him good, but Jesus was pointing out
that the word “good” is used when referring to God.
Therefore, the man spoke correctly.
WHy would he complain like that if he really was God? Was he speaking in third person, because if thats the case, that would be the ONLY time god speaks in third person. It was not until paul stepped in to announce that the blood of Christ will wash away your sins. I also believe that you are taking that verse I mention out of context, not me. Lets see it again in its full context: MARK 10:17-20. As he was starting out on a trip, a man came running up to Jesus, knelt down, and asked, “Good Teacher, what should I do to get eternal life?”"Why do you call me good?” Jesus asked. “Only God is truly good. But as for your question, you know the commandments: `Do not murder. Do not commit adultery. Do not steal. Do not testify falsely. Do not cheat. Honor your father and mother.’ ” “Teacher,” the man replied, “I’ve obeyed all these commandments since I was a child.” If Jesus were to refer himself as God, then he would have said something like, “Why do you call me good teacher? Only God is truely Good…” Jesus questioning the man in mark 10:17 implies that he is not truely good and only God is good. There anr instances in the gospel where Jesus prays to God; and if your arguement is that Jesus was separated from God during his time on earth, I find that ludicrous because God is omnipotent and omniscient.
Romans 3:10 says “There is no one righteous, not even
one.” This passage is referring to us. None of us are
good or righteous. We are not worthy of the gift God
gave us by sending Jesus. Verse 21-24 of Romans 3 says
“But now a righteousness from God apart from law, has
been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets
testify. This righteousness from God comes through
faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no
difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the
glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace
through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”
Apart from the LAW? But didnt Jesus come to refine the law? NOT destroy it. As stated in the old testament… salvation comes through repentence of ones sins; NOT through an intermediary. In the old testament, man is judged by his deeds, not by his faith. Actions speak louder than words, good deeds is the manifestation of a good heart. Saying and Thinking it is cheap and has no FRUIT.
Jesus was and is the perfect sacrifice. We don’t
deserve God’s love, but He gives it to us willingly
and at all times as He waits for us to realize who He
is and how much we need Him. God is fair and just. It
is us who gain much by turning from our old lives of
sin in order to pursue new lives through Christ. All
we need to do is come to Him and allow Jesus to bridge
the gap that stands between us and God due to our
sins.
Here’s a scenario: two men in a deserted island. One prays to God (but not a christian), the other doesnt believe in God or the heaven/hell. Who’s better off? (First answer, then scroll down to reveal question)
If you said the person who Prays to God is better off. Then that tells me that you have weak faith on the concept of Trinity. Lets face it, the trinity is not mentioned in the Bible. Jesus never said anything about worshiping 3 parts of God.
Thanks again for the reply, and I hope to hear from you soon, take care and God Bless.
-Tomas
December 22nd, 2005 at 6:15 pm
Here are 2 more emails from Tomas…
EMAIL #1
” Christians believe that there will be no world
peace until Jesus returns again i.e. the Second
Coming. So, even though there has been about 2005
years since Jesus was on Earth, his 2nd coming has not
taken place. Thus, no world peace. His first coming
was for Him to die for the sins of the people. The 2nd
coming is to set up His kingdom. ”
Where is that in the old testament? There is no reference to such a delayed 2nd coming of the same Messiah anywhere in the OT. JC himself promised his followers that he would succeed in his own era: “Verily I say to you that there be some of them who stand here, which shall not taste of death until they have seen the kingdom of GOD come with power” (Mark 9:1); “Verily I say to you that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done” (Mark 13:30). But the things were not done, and JC was instead killed.
JC lived at the time of Roman suppression of the Jews. The Jewish people eagerly looked forward to the arrival of the Moshiach. They were certainly well-versed in the requirements to be filled by the true Moshiach, and would definitely have accepted the Moshiach if it was clear that he had appeared. Yet the Jews of that time rejected JC’ claims to be the Messiah. They knew and saw JC in the flesh, and found him wanting; on the other hand, Paul of Tarsus, who established the Christian religion, never knew JC personally. If JC were indeed the Messiah, why did his fellow Jews, who had every reason to want a Messiah, almost unanimously reject him?
If it wasnt for Emp. Constantine (Founder of Catholicism), you wouldnt have the bible. It was all compiled and gathered by men. Constantine took advantage of the “meek servant” concept of christianity and made an empire out of it. How come JC never wrote anything? How come Barnabas and other writings about JC were DISREGARDED?
As I see it, christianity used to be a monothesitic religion.. but became fused with paganism and idol worship; just take a look at christmas- its not even JC’s birthday, it was made up by roman leaders who wanted to appease pagan appetite- hence, thats what made swine lawful to eat.
EMAIL #2
Im gonna get down to the nitty gritty about your beef with Islam and your “exposure” to Islam.
1. Many years ago, Allah was one god of many supposed gods. Mohammed chose Allah as the one god of Islam . Yet, Allah was a pagan god before Mohammed chose him. Allah was the Moon God . It is also interesting that the Islamic symbol is a moon.
The word “GOD” comes from the Anglo-Saxon God which came from German Gott akin to Persian khoda and Hindu khooda. The name “GOD” is just as PAGAN as Miles accuse the name “Allah” as pagan.
If you knew arabic, which I DOUBT you do. The name “Allah” is a combination of two words; Al (The) and ilah(god). “Ilah” is similar from aramaic.. Elahi, Eloi, Elohim (plurality of God). (i.e. Eloi Eloi, lama sabach’thani!” Think about it.. instead of saying, “I worship a god” (which sounds weak), muslims say, “I worship THE God” (Which sounds stronger with conviction)
Now on with the moon symbol. What happened 6 centuries after the death of Muhammed? The ottoman empire was founded and its national symbol was the crecent moon; the ottoman empire was responsible for conquering the half of the christian empire and constantinople. (BTW, the ottoman turks, not the arabs, spread islam by the sword.) With such a victory; supposively predicted in the Holy Quran, the muslims adopted the crescent moon in their mosques to commemorate that victory.
2. Allah is one god while Lord God, Jehovah, is a Trinity. Miles said that Muslims think that the fact that Christians have the Trinity causes them to believe that Christianity is a polytheistic religion (the belief in more than one god). The Quran states “God has not taken to Himself any son, nor is there any god with Him: For then each god would have taken of that which he created and some of them would have risen up over others.” That is far from the truth, to those of us who are Christians. God is the Father, Son and Holy Spirit in one. Each part of the Trinity has a different function, but they are one in the same.
During the time of Mohammed. The ONLY christianity in existance was CATHOLICISM and ORTHODOXY… and if there were born-again evangelical protestants, they would have been burned at the stake and forgetten.
Christianity at that time was adamant about 3 gods in one. I was raised catholic, and I used to PRAY to Mary, Joseph, MIchael the archangel, st. timothy, statues of madonna (not the pop singer). I kissed the feet of statues, gave offerings and inscense to statues. Go to a catholics home and youll see images of Jesus, mary, baby jesus, St. Michael, Lady of Guadalupe, etc… these are all graven images. One thing that disturbed me is the way they are portrayed as minor GODS; almost emulate that of pagan rome.
3. Then, there are the differences between the Muslim Allah and Jehovah God. Jesus came to Earth and died for us. He was tempted in all the things that we are tempted in, yet He did not give in to those temptations. Thus, he can relate to what we’re going through, but is our ultimate example of not giving into sin. Yet, Allah in the Muslim faith is so high above people that he cannot relate to his followers. He is not sympathetic to them because he has never come to Earth and does not suffer for them. Instead, Muslims suffer for Allah. Even though Allah is referred to in the Quran, “In the name of God, the Merciful, the Compassionate.”, there is at least one thing which Allah cannot ever forgive. It is stated that “Islam considers associating any deity or personality with God as a deadly sin which God will never forgive, despite the fact He may forgive all other sins.” Jehovah God will always forgive every sin, if the person truly comes to Him, repents and ask for forgiveness. God knows our hearts, minds and souls. He knows when we truly mean what we say and He will forgive those who truly want His forgiveness, no matter what they have done.
Did you even read the Quran to find this out for yourself, or did you accept it cause your Miles told you so? Associating partners with God is an unforgiveable sin if you DIE in that sin.
“Tell them: My people, who have transgressed upon their own selves, do not despair of God’s mercy. Indeed God shall forgive all the sins [if you truly repent and correct your behavior]. (Al-Zumar 39: 53)
Now before you went to pluck the stick out of the muslim eye, why not pluck the beam out of your own eye:
Matthew (12:31-32), Jesus said, “…every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.”
Yiiikes, in this age or in the age to come?
4. Muslims are servants to Allah and Christians are God’s children. Muslims are there to submit to Allah and to do what he says. Even getting into Heaven is a difficult task for Muslims. Where Christians follow God, believe in God and Jesus’ sacrifice, love Him and leave their old lives of sin for God in order to have eternal life in Heaven, Muslims must have more good deeds in life in order to outweigh the bad. They believe that once they die, they are judged and if they have performed more good deeds than bad, they can get into heaven. If there are more bad deeds, they cannot. To me, that’s a scary thought. I am far from perfect and am so glad that Jesus died on the cross and took upon Himself the punishment for all of the sins I have committed and will commit in my life.
So the JEWS, the truely observant jews are not God’s children??? All that praying 3 times a day, doing good deeds, setting up jewish hospitals all over the world, making the best bagels and lox for the goyim, and actually loving their God.. are NOT God’s children? Only christians are going to heaven. So good deeds dont count huh? Ive met jewish, muslim, sihk, atheist, and hindu physicians.. the most nicest and trustworthy people ive ever worked with (im a male nurse)… you mean to tell me they’re going to hell? I could understand an atheist going to hell… but not the God fearing ones? So a pedophile seriel rapist who is minutes away from execution who makes a spur of the moment decision to truely believe in Christ and that he died for his sins goes to heaven??? This is why I see more and more christians in the streets, tv and in my everyday business just dress how they want to dress, cuss, talk about their sexual encounters to everyone, sleep around, racists, hateful, spiteful… its all good ’cause you’re bathed by the blood of Christ. “sin now and repent later.”
“That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame. For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
read this link in response to that quote from Paul (the fraud): http://www.thenazareneway.com/
5. Knowledge of God is a wonderful part of the Christian faith. To know God is to be in relationship with Him. Jehovah God already knows us intimately and loves us greatly. He knows what we’re thinking and saying even before it is thought or said. He also wants us to know Him intimately. In order to do that, He gives us the Holy Bible, which reveals who He is and what His will is for us. It also tells us about the life of Jesus, whom we look to as our perfect example. We also have prayer, where we talk to God and He can also speak to us if we are willing to listen. We also have other Christian believers to point us to the Truth of God’s Word. It is so wonderful to know other, wiser Christians. We can learn so much from one another because some of us have experienced different things in life and we can share with eachother. On the flip side, Allah is unknowable. All that is really known is “That you may know that Allah is able to do all things, and that Allah knows all things.” It is believed that Allah is seated on his throne above the Earth and is looking down on everything. Thus, he knows it all, but it’s hard to know about him.
LIke I said, step out of your evangelical box and read the Qur’an and talk to muslims. Go to your nearest mosque; go straight to the source.
6. Allah’s love is earned while Jehovah’s love is received. Allah loves those who obey him and hates the sinner. Jehovah God loves the sinner. Since the fall of Adam and Eve, there is no way for us to be perfect, so we are all sinners.
This concept of sin is SOOO alien to jews and muslims. Christianity is the reason why women were’nt allowed to vote or hold the presidential office.
December 22nd, 2005 at 6:16 pm
Tomas…
Thank you for your extensive coverage of my last
email. All of the Quran verses were from my own
research of it online. None of it was from Miles. I
would agree with you that pagan worship is wrong. I am
not Catholic and do not believe in praying to other
saints, worshiping in front of statues or honoring
Mary. I can see how that would upset you.
I think our disagreements come down to two
differing religions. If we are unwilling to accept the
other, we will always disagree. For example, you look
to the Old Testament only to prove Jesus’ second
coming and other facts. I also look to the New
Testament. I believe to fulfill the law of the Old
Testament, which included sacrificing to God. I
believe that Jesus was the final physical sacrifice,
but I also believe that we must sacrifice our old
lives to live a new life for God.
Though Jesus’ first coming was prophesized in
Isaiah 7:14, 9:6-7, and Zechariah 14:4, His second
coming was proclaimed by Jesus Himself in the New
Testament. If you don’t believe that the NT holds
water, then there’s another disagreeing point.
I also agree with you that there are many good
people in this world who are kind and giving and do
good deeds, even if they do not believe in God. I am
not saying they aren’t “good”. I am just saying that
they have no guarantee of eternal life in Heaven
without knowing Jesus as their Lord and Savior. That’s
all it comes down to. No person on this earth is
perfect. We all make mistakes. Some Christians may not
follow their faith whole-heartedly. I wish they all
would, but that is just not the case and it makes me
sad. Even I fall short because I am not perfect. Only
Jesus was.
The point of my blog was to explain the
differences between Christianity and Islam. I also
have an article on why not to worship objects, such as
in the Catholic faith. There are differences. If we
believed the same things, we would not have different
religions. If we thought we followed the same god, we
would not have so many divisions, but we don’t follow
the same religion and we do disagree. In the midst of
that, I am always interested to know what other faiths
believe. Not to follow them necessarily, but just to
know where other people are coming from. So, I thank
you for the input you have provided. We could probably
go round and round with who is right and who is wrong,
but if we can never come to a common ground, it is
almost not worth doing so because it would just cause
us to be upset.
I fully believe in what I believe and I can see
that you feel the same way. I do not believe every
person will go to Heaven no matter how many good deeds
they do. I do believe in Hell. It all comes down to
what the Truth is and submitting our lives fully to
that Truth.
December 27th, 2005 at 11:52 pm
Tomas you wrote: So the JEWS, the truely observant jews are not God’s children??? All that praying 3 times a day, doing good deeds, setting up jewish hospitals all over the world, making the best bagels and lox for the goyim, and actually loving their God.. are NOT God’s children? Only christians are going to heaven. So good deeds dont count huh? Ive met jewish, muslim, sihk, atheist, and hindu physicians.. the most nicest and trustworthy people ive ever worked with (im a male nurse)… you mean to tell me they’re going to hell? I could understand an atheist going to hell… but not the God fearing ones? So a pedophile seriel rapist who is minutes away from execution who makes a spur of the moment decision to truely believe in Christ and that he died for his sins goes to heaven??? This is why I see more and more christians in the streets, tv and in my everyday business just dress how they want to dress, cuss, talk about their sexual encounters to everyone, sleep around, racists, hateful, spiteful… its all good ’cause you’re bathed by the blood of Christ. “sin now and repent later.â€
First off I dont want you to think that I’m trying to argue with you. It’s just that whenever I see someones view point on Christianity, and if it seems wrong, I like to try and help the person to understand it, ( i know that certain people and situations have kinda warped Christianity’s rep..so i understand there is some confusion these days)
Anyway, about your statement…This is the beauty of Salvation through Christ: If a serial rapist was getting ready to die, and the Holy Spirit was convicting him one last time, yes, if the man finally said yes to the Lord, he would be forgiven and would receive salvation instantly and would die and go to heaven. And about the verse you put in earlier about blasphemy against the Holy Spirit being the unforgiveable sin in Christianity. Well, it is, but a lot of people dont really know what that sin means. I didn’t for a long time. But finally I was taught what it means. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is saying “NO” too many times. The Holy Spirit, who is part of the Trinity (not a separate god, but another form of God) was sent to this earth to be our comforter after Christ ascended back to heaven. That conviction that people feel in their heart, is the Holy Spirit drawing them to Christ. THe person then has a choice to either accept or reject. A person may reject a few times and then finally says yes. But after so long, a person may say NO too many times and the Holy Spirit will stop convicting. When a person rejects Jesus Christ as his means for salvation, that is the blashphemy against the Holy Ghost that the verse spoke of. THat is the only sin that is unforgiveable. Any other sin, you name it, God fully can and will forgive. But rejecting His Son and choosing another way, is the unforgiveable sin.
I hope that i didn’t come across as rude or overbearing–that was not my intention at all. I just get very passionate about this subject b/c i want everyone to understand Christ’s love and sacrifice. I pray that this made sense to you and that you realize I’m not trying to argue with you, I simply wanted to try and clear a few things up for you. = )
All those people that set up hostpitals feed the poor etc, are doing great things for humankind. Yet, it doesn’t count if it isn’t being done for the Lord. Our works are as filthy rags. Man tries and tries to find his own way to God, but Jesus clearly stated in John 14:6 “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father,but by me.” Good works are great, we are to do good works in this life, but that isn’t the way to eternal life. I would much rather accept the simple message of salvation than struggle to live a life of good works, worrying if im going to end up having enough good works that outway the bad.
Also, those Christians that you mention that dress dirty, and talk even more dirty, etc, aren’t really Christians. Let me explain: The word Christian means Christ-like. Christians themselves didn’t decide to give themselves that name. Actually, unbelievers gave followers of God that name back in the New Testament b/c they tried so hard to be like Christ. Therefore, someone may be saved, but they may not be a Christian, living like Christ and following His commands. THere are also those who profess to be “Christians” these days that certainly are not. They don’t understand what it means to be a Christian. It’s more than wearing a cross and doing a good deed after going to church on Sunday. It’s more than a “spiritual fad” I’ve heard people say, “I used to be a Christian, but i realized it wasnt for me” Once you are saved, you are saved. So either they meant that they used to be Christ-like, or they are saying that they got saved and decided not to be anymore–impossible. The Bible speaks of those that professed to be in the faith but then left. That shows they never were in the faith to begin with. So, Thomas, if I made any sense at all, what i was trying to get across, is that there are those today that profess to be Christians, and really are not, so their lifestyle gives Christianity a bad wrap. True Christianity involves those that are passionately trying to live for Jesus Christ. They desire to live a pure and holy life and to daily serve Him in all ways. Also, realize that Christians can back-slide. While they can’t lose their salvation, they can lose their fellowship with Christ. Like Stephanie said, we’re still sinners, we’re just saved sinners. We’ll never be perfect. Hypocrisy is all over, not just in Christianity.
I hope this made sense and that I didn’t come across as overbearing or rude. I just get passionate about the subject of my Lord. And if I see any misunderstandings, I try and do my best, with the Lord’s help, to set things straight. I want people to realize how amazing the life lived in Christ truly is. Thanks for your time Tomas. = ) If you have any questions or anything, just say so.
January 9th, 2006 at 6:08 pm
i just want 2 start off by saying there are to many religions out there for any one to say theres is right.i mean every religion believes in good & evil,but still have different beliefs in god.but all religion has the same belief in the devil.what im trying to say is no one can come eye to eye about god,but they do with the devil.funny huh?evil seems to be taking toll over everybody.i dont think you can be a sinner for EX:40 years ask for forgiveness and so happens six months later you die your sins will be forgiven and you go staight to heaven.and i dont belive you should kill any sole for any reason expecally in the name of the lord or allah.i believe in jesus christ as my lord and salvation but at the same time i believe you will be punnished for what you do.i mean really if your children did something there not supposed to do, and know there doin it, thats wrong and they must be punnished,right.and if getting to heaven really that easy why is there a hell.he gave us rules to go by and its up to us to obey them.if your a good person and you love your neighbor as your brother i believe thats what matters most.the devil is what keeps the conflect goin,he broke the name of god up,to keep us from the truth,but god left all the devils name intact so you can know the truth also.jesus,allah,virgin mary,budda,etc. how can you say one of them is right. what if they all were right.i just know what ever it takes to make you a better person and makes you happy go with it.without being right.this is just my beliefes,theres know study,just how i feel.so before you critize me and my beliefs,im not telling you your wrong im just saying look at all religion as one.the world will be a happier home.
im not a good speller so please fogive me.
love you
January 9th, 2006 at 6:36 pm
I believe that it doesn’t matter how nice we are or how many good things we do. You could be a “good” person and help the poor for 50+ years, take care of orphans, give all your money to save the whales, and cut your hair for Locks of Love, but without a belief in Jesus, it’ll get you nowhere. It’s not about us and what makes us happy. What matters is God and how we serve Him. I believe we were made to worship God. We are programmed to worship. That’s why we all worship something, whether we worship God or not. What matters is our belief in the Truth of Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord. Not all religions believe in the devil and Hell. Mormonism is an example of one religion that does not have that belief.
Yes, evil is prevalent in our world. The devil has been given the opportunity to test us, but God is ultimately in control. He won’t let Satan push us beyond our limits.
I can understand that you feel strongly about your beliefs and I would encourage you to look at the Bible and see what it says as well. See Luke 23:32-43. It is a good example of a criminal who hung on a cross beside Jesus, was saved from Hell right before death and went to Heaven.
Thank you for your comment.
January 10th, 2006 at 9:54 am
but how do you know?you dont! your goin off a faith you enjoy or was raised to believe from childhood.so your basicly saying if im not a christian i wont go to heaven?people look in the bible for ansewers all the time.not me,becouse everything you quote from the bible regarding your statement i can quote from the bible regarding mine.the king james version was wrote for the a white king,why do you think jesus is blonde haired blue eyes,and in the bible it says they couldnt tell him from the every day people.blonde hair blue eyes would stand out alittle dont ya think.and i believe king james removed stuff from the real bible to fit his beliefs.how many people are going to argue with the king.and since this country was founded by white people that is the main belief in the usa.most black people over here are mostly christians becouse thats what they were tought.if jesus was from the middle east you would believe they would know more than americans.why are there so many different bibles,if its supposed to be the word of god.they all cant be right,so what makes you think yours is,again you dont! i believe in jesus like you do but at the same time i cant tell people they wont go to heaven if they dont believe in christ becouse i dont know.”thats my belief” but thats not muslim belief.so is it fair for me to tell them there wrong.you can only preach what you were touhgt.what makes me believe in god is yor sole.its a felling,its knowing right from wrong,so again i cant tell people there wrong for not believing in christ becouse thats what you know.i’ll leave it at this if you were born in japan and lived there most of your live,your probley gonna believe in what they believe,so are they wrong for believing what they were tought since childhood?
January 10th, 2006 at 10:44 am
I, personally, do not use the King James Version, so the version I used was not “altered” by a king, as you believe. There are many different versions of the Christian Holy Bible, but they are ultimately telling the same message. Some are just in different formats for easier reading, while some are closest to the original manuscripts word-wise. Yet, they still proclaim Jesus as God and the Savior of the world.
I also don’t believe that the pictures we see of Jesus as blonde with blue eyes are accurate. They are an artist’s representation especially considering that it is believed Jesus was not a good looking man at all.
Yes, Jesus was from the Middle East, but that does not mean that His homeland would be following after Him. In the Bible, there are many examples of Jesus being questioned by even those He grew up with. They were quite skeptical, as many people still are today.
Please, I encourage you send me your Bible quotes that back up your beliefs.
March 28th, 2006 at 2:07 am
Anybody consider that this is all useless speculation? I pray god strikes me with one of Zeus’s thunderbolts. Nothing you people are talking about has any demonstrable physical reproducible manifestation. Burning bush giving Moses the shizzle? Bring it on…
Oh, can’t be done now, today, because it’s a freaking miracle. Nice. Parting the Red Sea. Yeah, it’s called the Suez Canal last I heard. Divinity, granted to the human form, seems possible in the way we treat each other. This belief that a historical figure, and somehow an emulation of a culture that is lost to us in time, will result in a “what?†Do you really want to live forever? Why?
April 15th, 2006 at 11:11 pm
ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ISLAM AND CHRISTINATY IS THE DEVINITY OF CHRIST PBUH. OTHER DIFFERENCES WE CAN RESOLVE THROUGH DIALOGS. JUST ONE THING FOR OUR CHRISTEN FOLLOWERS THAT THIS IS THE UNANIMOUS AGREEMENT BETWEEN CHRISTEN THEOLOGING THAT CHRISTANITY DON’T HAVE THE ORIGINOL BIBLE. WHICH MAKE THE HUGE DIFFERENCE ON THE CRITICAL AREA OF FAITH? HOWEVER, IT IS ESSIENTIAL FOR BOTH FAITHS THAT DIALOGES SHOULD CONTINUE.
April 17th, 2006 at 8:50 pm
Stephanie,
You need to know that Islam, Judaism, and Christianity are monotheistic religion this is agreed by these three faiths unanimously so there isn’t different God. It is the same God in these three religions. Since this is not a dispute among these three religions on the highest level that’s why please do not mention it. It will be very naïve if you kept on believing different God for each religion.
This might enlighten you if you are willing to listen. Every thing I am saying in the following you can verify through the Christen literature.
1- Jesus is not the name of Jesus
2- Bible is not the name of Bible
3- Yeheshwa (Jesus) never heard in his life time the word “Christianityâ€
Christ’s mother tong was not English. Christ’s words were not preserved. The Bible you read is translated from Greek menu script at the time when English language did not even exist. The most ancient Greek menu scripts are found in Christendom are approximately four hundred years after Christ. In other words the Bible or Bibles you are reading today is not the original teaching of Christ. I know you and other Christen won’t like this but unfortunately it is very true according to the Christen history. However, if anyone would like to rebuttal what you said above with the available Christen literature still it won’t be difficult to do so for example if you read:
James 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
James 2:26 negate many thing you said above including Romans 10:9-13. If you are a good Christ follower as you seems like then you should acknowledge what Islam or Quran is saying about Christ? Islam is the only faith after Christianity that recognizes Christ. Here are the few verse of Quran I would like to quote that talks about Christ and his mother Mary peace be upon them.
Quran 3:42 Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah hath chosen thee and purified thee- chosen thee above the women of all nations.
Quran 3:43 “O Mary! Worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down”
Quran 3:44 this is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which We reveal unto thee (O Messenger!) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point).
Quran 3:45 Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah;
This is good that you made effort to learn about Islam. However, moon has nothing to do with Islamic faith. Please keep things intellectual and knowledge base let us learn about you and you should learn about us, at the end what everyone follows is there own business.
April 18th, 2006 at 3:01 am
I would have to disagree that Christians today do not include the teachings of Christ. Even if the English language did not exist when the original Bible was written, it is naive to think that it could not be translated into other languages later on. If that be true, then we could believe no text that was ever translated, including ancient writings or poetry. I believe that scholars have translated the Bible well.
You say that Islam, Judaism and Christianity have the same God. Judaism was the religion that Jesus was raised in, so I will count Judaism as having the same God. The Jews were waiting for a king to come. Jesus came, He was that king, but the Jews have yet to acknowledge Him. If Islam believed in the same God, then they would also believe that Jesus is the Son of God and would not acknowledge Muhammad. Muhammad is placed in a very high position within the Islamic faith. Muhammad is not Jesus. Muhammad did not come to Earth to die for our sins. Muhammad did not raise from the dead. Muhammad is dead today. Jesus raised from the dead and is alive, which is the reason for our recent Easter celebrations.
Jesus came to fulfill the law of the Old Testament and He did so in His death. He took away the need to sacrifice animals to cover over sins. Jesus was the final sacrifice for us all. As a Christian, I do not believe you can take pieces of the Bible and believe what you want. Therefore, you cannot just believe in God, not believe in Jesus and still go to Heaven. It just doesn’t happen that way. Jesus is the only Way, the only Truth and the only Life. None other after Him can claim that they came to save the world. I have read that Muhammad came and did not entirely reject Christianity and Judaism, but did he entirely accept them? If he did, then Islam would not be a separate religion.
It is believed that a separation between Islam and Christianity occured between Isaac and Ishmael, sons of Abraham by 2 different women. Isaac was born to Abraham and his wife, Sarah. Ishmael was born first to Abraham and Sarah’s servant girl, Hagar. Abraham was told by God that he and Sarah would have a child in their old age. Both seemed impatient and Sarah told Abraham to conceive a child with Hagar. In Genesis 16, it says that Hagar was told ” 11 The angel of the LORD also said to her:
“You are now with child
and you will have a son.
You shall name him Ishmael,
for the LORD has heard of your misery.
12 He will be a wild donkey of a man;
his hand will be against everyone
and everyone’s hand against him,
and he will live in hostility
toward all his brothers.”
My studies have shown me that Islam came from the descendants of Ishmael and Christianity from the descendants of Isaac. To this day, there is hostility between the 2 faiths and between the nations that hold these faiths.
I believe there is a separation between the two and even though the Arabic word for God is “Allah”, that is primarily because Arabic countries are primarily Islamic. In English, we can use the word “god” for many things. I can make money my god. Yet, when I speak of God, I am referring to God, the Almighty Creator of the universe. I think Allah is used in the same fashion and has more than one meaning depending on belief. Ask any Arabic-speaking Christian. They don’t follow the god of Islam, but the God of Christianity.
April 22nd, 2006 at 9:53 pm
Stephanie: You practice Christianity and you are a devout christen and I respect your faith. The faith you follow, you follow it for your salvation. That’s why it is absolutely necessary that you should follow the original scripture preached by Jesus. According to Christens Scholars, Christen Doctors of Divinity, and fifty Cooperating Christen Denominations unanimously agreed that “Christianity don’t have the scripture preached by Jesus†I know for a devout christen it is mind boggling but it is true. It is your religious experts those who are saying this, Islam said it fourteen hundred years ago.
Here is my point i.e. if you have the right to quote Bible than you should give the same right to others to quote Bible. I quoted James 2:26 in response to your quote of Romans 10:9-13 and on this quote you said “I do not believe you can take pieces of the Bible and believe what you want†Well, do I have lesser right to quote Bible? We are talking to each other not converting each other. James 2:26 over writes Romans 10:9-13 and it is coming from Bible your holy book.
Assuming, I have the same right to quote Bible as you do. With this understanding I am going to comment here. It is my utmost desire to share this with every Christen; for a Muslim it is an absolute requirement that he or she should believe on Christ and his miracles. Islam is the only faith after Christianity that recognizes Christ to its fullest. Islam believes that Christ gave life to dead, he healed blind and leapers, and he will come back again, and he is the Messiah
You said “I have read that Muhammad came and did not entirely reject Christianity and Judaism, but did he entirely accept them? If he did, then Islam would not be a separate religion†To this, Muslims are saying if you would have had the original teaching of Christ you would have not been Christian today! It’s Christen who did not accept Mohammed, Muslims accept all prophets you name it; Ibraheem, Moses, Solomon, David, Jonah, Lot, Isaac, Ismael, Jesus, Mohammed peace be upon them all.
Quran give highest respect to Christ I am saying this without any bias you can verify that. Just a few examples here, there is a whole chapter in the holy Quran in the honor of Mary Jesus mother you wont find this kind of honor given to Mary in the Bible. Quran made Muslims believe that Jesus was born by Virgin Mary. Quran describe Jesus in the following honorable way:
Quran 3:42 Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah hath chosen thee and purified thee- chosen thee above the women of all nations.
Quran 3:43 “O Mary! Worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down”
Quran 3:44 this is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which we reveal unto thee (O Messenger!) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point).
Quran 3:45 Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah;
When you said “Arabic-speaking Christian, They don’t follow the god of Islam, but the God of Christianity†Please understand this ACCORDING TO JUDISM, CHRISTANITY, HUNDUISM, BUDHISM, AND ISLAM GOD IS THE SAME IN ALL RELIGION. There is only one God, all religion believe on it and they don’t dispute on it even Christianity. God is not the dispute among faiths it is the later religious figures after God on which different faiths have their different point of views.
You mention Genesis 16 and mischief of Ismael. My question to you is who fought World War one and two, the greatest ever human devastation in the history of mankind? Who dropped nuclear bomb on innocent people? Who practice slavery? Who killed American Indian? Who killed six million Jews? Were they descendent of Ismael or Isaac? I would suggest you to read proper history you will know the answer.
If your studies can reach up to Isaac and Ismael, then why not you get to the Abraham? Who was biological father of Isaac and Ismael. If you are quoting Bible to show Isaac’s superiority than please read the following verse from the Bible to learn Ishmael’s superiority.
Genesis 16:10: And the angel of the LORD said unto her [Hagar], I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.
Genesis 17:20: And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.
Genesis 21:13: And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he [is] thy seed.
Genesis 21:18: Arise, lift up the lad (Ishmael), and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation.
Deuteronomy 21:15-17: “If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated, and they have born him children, both the beloved and the hated; and if the firstborn son be hers that was hated: Then it shall be, when he maketh his sons to inherit that which he hath, that he may not make the son of the beloved firstborn before the son of the hated, which is indeed the firstborn: But he shall acknowledge the son of the hated for the firstborn, by giving him a double portion of all that he hath: for he is the beginning of his strength; the right of the firstborn is his.â€
Islam doesn’t deny Allah’s blessings on Isaac and his descendents, but the son of promise is Ishmael from whom later arose Mohammed PBUH as the Seal of all Prophets.
April 23rd, 2006 at 1:12 pm
I am not sure who the “religious experts” are that you are speaking of who say that Christians do not have Jesus’ true words. There are many who try to attack Christianity and say it is false, but such statements remain only opinion. Even though people may study the Bible and have great knowledge, it does not necessarily mean they know the truth. Only by believing and receiving Jesus as Savior and Lord are the truths within the Bible revealed entirely to the believer through the Holy Spirit. I continue and will always believe that the Bible is all Truth and that it is filled with words directly from God Himself. None of the Bible contradicts itself because God does not contradict Himself. If He did, He would not be the True God. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 says “All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.” Revelation 22:18-19 says “I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book. ” That is why I believe that the Book of Mormon is false and all other books that add to or subtract from Scripture of the Bible are not to be believed.
I do not deny you the right to quote from the Bible. I only ask that you understand what you are reading. James 2:26 does not “overwrite” Romans 10 in the least. It all works together. In Ephesians 2:8-10, it says “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them. Yes, we are to do good works, but that is not what saves us or gets us to Heaven. To have salvation, we must accept the free gift of God. God sent His Son, Jesus, to Earth to die for us in order that we would not have to suffer the punishment for all the sins in our lives. Without that belief, we are not saved. After salvation, Christians should do good things. Yet, we do not lose our salvation without works and do not earn any points for performing those works. If we have the Holy Spirit within us, it becomes our desire to do good things and serve those around us. Good works are also an outward sign of an inward change within us. It shows that we have the Holy Spirit within us and that we want to serve, just as our perfect example, Jesus, served. We are called to serve. That is what the verse in James is pointing out. Without the Spirit in our lives, we are dead. Without works, our faith is dead; meaning it is stagnant. It is not growing if we don’t serve. It does not mean we have lost our faith or salvation because salvation cannot be lost once it is gained. As John 10:27-19 says, “My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.”
As a Christian, I believe that Jesus was more than just a prophet who did good works and healed people. I believe:
1. Jesus was the final prophet.
2. He was God in human form (100% man and 100% God).
3. He fulfilled the Old Testament need to sacrific animals because He was the final sacrifice. He willingly sacrificed Himself, which was the reason He came to Earth.
4. He is one part of the Trinity (Father, Son and Holy Spirit). Yet, Christianity is still a monotheistic religion because the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are still one God.
5. Jesus was perfect. He was tempted by Satan to sin, but did not give into sin. He understand what it feels like to be tempted, so He can relate to us. He is our perfect example.
There are more things I believe about Jesus, but I will stop with those 5 for now.
I find it interesting that the Quran mentions Mary. To what degree of esteem is Mary held in Islam?
I also find it interesting that you said all religions have the same god. Buddhism doesn’t really follow a god. They follow the teachings of Buddha and seek to end all kinds of suffering in life through meditation, purification, following the teachings of Buddha and living a moral life. No god there, just Buddha, a mere man.
Hinduism believes in reincarnation, karma and many philosophies. Though they have a god called Īshvara, they also believe in demigods or celestial entities called Devas. So, neither Buddhism or Hinduism are the same as Christianity, Judaism or Islam. Though other religions believe in the concept of god, it does not mean we all believe in the same god.
Even though there have been many wars since the creation of the world, I don’t think you can blame everything on Americans or Christianity. All countries have been involved in war whether between themselves or with other countries. I’m not sure which you were referring to. You asked: “My question to you is who fought World War one and two, the greatest ever human devastation in the history of mankind? Who dropped nuclear bomb on innocent people?” WWI was France, Britain, U.S, and Russia vs. Germany, the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Ottoman Empire. WWII was multi-fold. It was Germany vs. Britain, France and the U.S. That’s when Hitler killed Jews because he thought they were inferior. It also involved Japan vs. the U.S. after the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor. That led to the bomb dropped on Japan.
“Who practice slavery?” was your next quesiton. Well, most countries have had slaves. The U.S. has had slaves, the Egyptians had Hebrew slaves, and medieval Muslims called Moors had slaves. Virtually every continent on the planet has had slaves. From Africa to Brazil to Asia, there have been slaves.
I am not trying to say that slavery and war are necessarily right. People are not perfect. Only Jesus was perfect. Therefore, we all sin. Disputes, wars, etc. are all due to sin on one side or both sides. If I misinterpreted the meaning behind your questions, please clarify.
You also mentioned “Islam doesn’t deny Allah’s blessings on Isaac and his descendents, but the son of promise is Ishmael from whom later arose Mohammed PBUH as the Seal of all Prophets.” I suppose Christianity can say that we don’t deny that God promised all of Abraham’s descendants to multiply. Yet, Christianity does not follow the line of Ishmael. That is what I mentioned in my previous entry. We follow the line of Isaac and don’t believe that Mohammed was a prophet. We believe in Jesus as the last and greatest prophet because He was and is God incarnate. I have some questions of my own and hope you can provide some insight.
1. What does the Quran say about Muhammed’s birth?
2. Does Islam believe that Christians are polytheistic because we believe in the Trinity?
3. Is Muhammed considered equal to or greater than Jesus? I have noticed a great deal in the news about Muslims being very upset about images of Muhammed. Do Muslims feel the same way about images of Jesus?
4. Do Muslims believe that one must earn their way into Heaven?
5. Is it blasphemous in Islam to say that Jesus is the Son of God? That he had a human mother, Mary, but that His Father is God?
6. Why do many Islamic countries punish people, via death, for converting a Muslim to another religion, usually Christianity? Do Muslims have the right to choose their religion without fearing death?
Thank you in advance for your answers.
May 4th, 2006 at 9:34 pm
According to the Christen scholars following are the ancient manuscripts from which all the Bibles are translated from. You can research or verify it from Christian theologians. The critical point is none of the menu script is coming from Jesus himself.
Codex Sinaiticus - Dates from the mid fourth century and originally included Old and New Testaments plus the Epistle of Barnabas and the Shepherd of Hermes, all in Greek. Brought out of St. Catherine’s Convent on Mount Sinai in 1859 this codex is currently in the British Museum in London.
Codex Vaticanus - Fourth century Greek codex of the Old and the New Testaments. The history of this codex is not known before it appears in a Vatican catalogue of 1475 although it is of the “Alexandrian” type of text. The book was open for scholarship in 1889. The original is still in the Vatican.
Codex Alexandrinus - Dates from the first half of the fifth century and originally contained both Old and New Testaments in Greek. The codex was moved from Alexandria to Constantinople and in 1627 to Britain. Now in the British Museum.
Codex Ephraemi - Early fifth century. A partial Greek copy of the Old and New Testaments which is currently held in the Bibliothèque Nationale in Paris.
Codex Bezae - late fifth or early sixth century. A bilingual edition in Greek and Latin of the Gospels and the Acts of the Apostles. In the possession of the University of Cambridge since 1581.
A classic example of error in the Bible: When Jews brought adulteress woman to Jesus and said Master “We caught her in the act” Jesus did not responded immediately instead he started scribbling on the sand. When Jews continue to question him, he said to them “Let the one who is without sin among you be the first to cast a stone at her” Accusers one after the other looked over his shoulder and left. Jesus looked up and said “Women, where are they? Is there no one condemns you? She replies “No one Lord†He than responded “Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more.†It is a wonderful story but what about the Law of Moses? “Adulterer and adulteress must be stone to death†What about the man who was involve in the adultery? Jesus said nothing about the adulterer man! Does the gospel encourage adultery? Do you believe Jesus can do this? These are the weakness you have in the Bible and the reason is simple i.e. these are not the teachings of Jesus these are Christens scribes who played around with the scriptures. Islam pointed changes in the Bible fourteen hundred years ago. There are many books written regarding the grave errors in the Bible here is one I can recommend you when you get chance please read it “Misquoting Jesus†by Bart D. Ehrman.
Believing “Jesus was 100% man and 100% God†is not supported by Bible itself please read the following verses from the Bible which negates the idea of Jesus being God.
Job 25:4-6: How then can man be justified with God? Or how can he be clean [that is] born of a woman? Behold even to the moon, and it shineth not; yea, the stars are not pure in His sight. How much less man, [that is] a worm? And the son of man, [which is] a worm?
Contrary to the idea of Jesus being God, Jesus himself said:
John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me.
John 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come [again] unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.
No, Jesus was not the final prophet because Jesus himself said, please read the following.
Matthew 15:22-24 And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, [thou] Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil. But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
What about rest of the world if he is the final Prophet? Jews in the past and in present have rejected him already with severe allegations. Quran came to rescue Jesus and his miracles birth by Mary. Notice the honors Quran has given to Jesus and his miracles birth.
Quran 3:42-45 Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah hath chosen thee and purified thee- chosen thee above the women of all nations. “O Mary! Worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down” this is part of the tidings of the things unseen, which we reveal unto thee (O Messenger!) by inspiration: Thou wast not with them when they cast lots with arrows, as to which of them should be charged with the care of Mary: Nor wast thou with them when they disputed (the point). Behold! The angels said: “O Mary! Allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah;
Mary mentioned in the several chapters of the Quran. I am quoting some above and some in the following. There is a translation of Quran by Abdullah Yousuf Ali which has a comprehensive index; you can read every thing under M about Mary, similarly under J about Jesus and so on.
Quran 19:16-26 Relate in the Book (the story of) Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place in the East. She placed a screen (to screen herself) from them; then We sent her our angel, and he appeared before her as a man in all respects. She said: “I seek refuge from thee to (Allah) Most Gracious: (come not near) if thou dost fear Allah.” He said: “Nay, I am only a messenger from thy Lord, (to announce) to thee the gift of a son. She said: “How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?” He said: “So (it will be): Thy Lord saith, ‘that is easy for Me: and (We wish) to appoint him as a Sign unto men and a Mercy from Us’: It is a matter (so) decreed.” So she conceived him, and she retired with him to a remote place. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm-tree: She cried (in her anguish): “Ah! would that I had died before this! would that I had been a thing forgotten and out of sight!” But (a voice) cried to her from beneath the (palm-tree): “Grieve not! for thy Lord hath provided a rivulet beneath thee; “And shake towards thyself the trunk of the palm-tree: It will let fall fresh ripe dates upon thee.â€So eat and drink and cool (thine) eye. And if thou dost see any man, say, ‘I have vowed a fast to (Allah) Most Gracious, and this day will I enter into not talk with any human being’”
There are quite a few important points in the above Quranic verses for the Christen followers i.e. Dates grow during summer in the southern hemisphere which means 25 December can not be Jesus birth day. Christens celebrates the Pagan holiday as Jesus birthday. Many Christen agreed that 25th December is the Pagan Holiday.
Islam doesn’t believe that Jesus was crucified. There are plenty of evidence in the Bible itself that doesn’t support the idea of crucifixion. For example if you read the following:
Matthew 12:38-40: Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee: But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Jesus responded to his disciples by comparing his three days absent with the live person Jonah in the Wheal’s belly. In other words he was not dead for three day and three nights according to Jesus himself. This is Islamic faith that Jesus can never ever lie abut his three days and three night absent.
We Muslims can not disagree with you about Jesus being a perfect man. This is not the point of dispute between these two great religions. In the teachings of Islam Prophets of God are innocent and they are the true servants of God.
It is true that all religions believe on same God it is the later personalities on witch different religion have points of contention. The name of God in Hinduism is ‘Iswara’ ‘Dharma’ ‘Bhagwan’ The name of God in Hebrew is ‘EL’ ‘Elahie’ ‘Eloheem’ in Islam the name of the God is ‘Allah’ ‘Elahie’ ‘Rubb’. In Hinduism Rama was the seventh reincarnation of God. Buddha was the ninth reincarnation of God. Since Christ mother tong was Aramaic and he addressed God as Elahie which is the same way Muslims and Jews address God.
The reason greatest ever human disaster was mentioned is because you talked about Ismael’s mischief and you quoted Bible to support your remarkes. I pointed the mischief of Isaac which happened to be out of proportion in comparison with the mischief of Ismael. In Islam we don’t compare Prophets but if you redeem the status of Ismael than Muslims have left no choice but to point out the descendents of Isaac’s mischief. This should not a point of contention that how much knowledge of Bible one possesses, the vital and tangible concern should be did the quote addresses the question?
West practiced slavery and Islamic world had servants the difference is West practice slavery in the form of ‘Uncle Tom’s Cabin’ while Islam never practiced slavery, there were servants who got paid for the work as a matter of fact servants still can be found in the Islamic countries, the main principal is you have to pay their wages. However, we Muslims have to admit that today Western world practice much higher level of human rights than any of the Islamic countries and without any doubt West deserves all the credits for this wonderful achievement.
The family tree you follow Muslims don’t have problem with that it is as good as it is following the family tree of Ismael. Jesus never mention that he was God or he was God incarnate, he never heard the word Christianity in his life time it all started after his death according to your interpretation, Muslims don’t believe that he was crucified.
Ans1: Quran doesn’t talk about Mohammed pbuh’s birth. His birth is mention in Islamic history books, and hadths books (Prophet’s saying). It is worth mentioning here that the books in Islam have separate levels: Quran is the word of God, Hadths is the word of Prophet, and there are books on Islam written by the historians; references from the books are referenced according to their original source. There is a strong system in place that maintain this hierarchy where as in Christianity Bible contains word of God, word of Prophet, and word of historians all in one place. For the followers of Christianity presence of Christ’s miracles birth in the holy Quran, and Mohammed’s birth being not mentioned, should clear many doubts that Quran is not the handy work of any human being, it is the revelation from God and there are plenty of verses in the Quran that supports Christen followers.
Ans2: No Islam doesn’t teaches that Christians are polytheist because of their believes in trinity. Quran speaks about Christianity as people of the book there is no where in the Quran Christens are mention as polytheist. Quran says the following about the Trinity:
Quran 4:117 O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messengers. Say not “Trinityâ€: desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs.
Quran 5:73 They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
Ans3: Islam doesn’t compare Prophets. In Islamic theology Mohammed pbuh never taught as he is superior to Christ or any other Prophet. Yes, in Islam you can not demean any Prophet by drawing their image, if it happened their will be consequences and its intensity depends upon the literacy rate of the community.
Ans4: Yes, Islam teaches you have to earn your own haven and it is not an easy path, God consciousness is essential tool to go thru this path successfully. Please read the following verses from the holy Quran and from the holy Bible.
Quran 35:18 And no burdened soul can bear another’s burden. And if one weighed down by a burden calls another to carry his load, naught of it will be carried, even though he be near of kin. You warn only those who fear their Lord in secret and keep up prayer. And whoever purifies himself, purifies himself only for his own good. And to Allah is the eventual coming.”
Quran 22:37 “It is not their flesh, nor their blood, reaches Allah, but to Him is acceptable observance of duty on your part. Thus has He made them subservient to you, that you may magnify Allah for guiding you alright. And give good news to those who do good.”
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
Ans5: In Islam it is blasphemous to say that Jesus is the Son of God. Mary as human mother of Christ is very much the same as she is in Christianity however she doesn’t have any relation with God. In Islam associating anyone with God is Blasphemy period.
Ans6: This question of yours is the product of western Medias work in peoples mind. Western media enjoy bashing Islam may be because Islam kept on flourishing on their homeland. In Islamic world there are Christians those who are living with Muslims for centuries and there is no such thing as fear of death on conversion, it is the hypocritical media that constantly exploits Islamic values. If you are taking recent Afghanistan issue than remember Afghanistan is in civil war for last twenty five years it is an absolutely law less country. Almost fifteen percent of the Middle Eastern population is Christian and there are Christen populations all over in the Islamic world. The actual Islamic law is if an individual is getting converted to other religion from Islam and the individual will be threat to the State only than punishing the individual is allowed other wise there is no fear in conversion, prior to punishing the individual there are stages of counseling. Media shouts because it is overwhelming for them to see each year approximately twenty thousand people becomes Muslim in the United State alone. I will conclude with the following quotes of George Bernard Shaw:
Sir George Bernard Shaw in ‘The Genuine Islam,’ Vol. 1, No. 8, 1936
“If any religion had the chance of ruling over England, nay Europe within the next hundred years, it could be Islam.” “I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence which can make it self appeal to every age. I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion far from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity.”
“I believe that if a man like him were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world he would succeed in solving its problems in a way that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness: I have prophesied about the faith of Muhammad that it would be acceptable to the Europe of tomorrow as it is beginning to be acceptable to the Europe of today.”
May 8th, 2006 at 10:31 pm
First of all, the manuscripts that you mentioned were all tainted, corrupted manuscripts than man had changed to put their own beliefs in. For example, Sinaticus and Vaticanus: “Codex Sinaiticus represents the Minority Text of the Alexandrian Text family, which has significant differences from the traditional text of the New Testament. As actually noted in Sinaiticus, both were baased upon the revised critical text of the heretic Origen, who took great liberties in altering the text to favor his Arian and Gnostic heresies. This text was further edited by Pamphilus and Eusebius, who also had Gnostic,/Arian leanings. Vaticanus and Sainaticus differ from one another in over 3,000 places in the Gospels alone.” Also, “Codex D (Bezae) is an extremely corrupt manuscript. Codex D removes 354 words from [the final three chapters of Luke], 250 of these words are omitted by no other manuscripte in existence.” It also adds words as well.–John Yates, Faith Bible Institute. Therefore, taking these manuscripts, it is easy to see problems, but it’s b/c heretical men tried to change the Word of God to their liking. Yet, the Bible says that God’s Word will be preserved from “this generatin forever” (Psalm 12:6-7) God has preserved His Word. The Majority text or Received text, is what my Bible is based on. God said His Words will never cease, so I believe they never will, therefore we can be SURE that we have the True Word of God even today! = )(see 2 Timothy 3:16)
Matthew 5:17 says “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill” When Christ came to earth, He was the fulfillment of the law. The great thing about Christ, is that when He came, He became our substitutionary death so that we wouldn’t have to pay for our sins anymore by making animal sacrifices. He was the FINAL sacrifice for ALL the world!!! (Whosoever will may come!) The law showed us that we are not good enough to “make it” to heaven. So Christ came that we may have a way to heaven–HE is the Way to heaven. Likewise with the woman. Christ wasn’t saying that adultery was no longer wrong, He forgave her b/c He had that power. Adultery will always be wrong. Yet, Christ came to forgive us of our sins, just as He did with the woman in the Bible that you mentioned. No one there that day could truly cast the first stone at her b/c they themselves were all filled with sin. Christ could have because He was perfect, yet, this story was proof that He came from God, and that He IS God, because He had the authority and power to forgive! No longer would we have to make animal sacrifices for our atonement. Christ became our atonement, once, for all. Praise God Almighty!
The Bible clearly says that Jesus was 100% man and 100% God. John 1:1 says, “In the beginning was the Word (Jesus) and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.” There are many, many more verses in the Bible that would back this up. If you want me to give you references please let me know and I will be glad to give those to you!
Job 25:4-6 does not speak of Jesus when it says the son of man (Im assuming that’s what you were refering to) the word son is the Hebrew word “ben” or “banah” which means to build, obtain children, so it seems that its speaking of just man on earth. Also, the person speaking in this verse is one of Jobs “friends” that speak things that aren’t accurate of God anyway. That doesn’t mean that the Word of God isn’t accurate at all. Its just telling the story of Job and how his friends are telling Job how pathetic and worthless he is in the state that he is in at the time.
I don’t understand how you’ve come to the premise that the Bible doesn’t support the fact that Christ was crucified. It’s absolutely evident! The crucifixion is why Christ came to the earth. His death by crucifixion is what gave us the chance for eternal life! This verse that you gave, Matt. 12:38-40 is another proof of how the Pharisees and scribes were constantly trying to find ways to discredit Jesus or make Him look foolish. The Pharisees, and especially the scribes, KNEW the Old Testament and should’ve known that Jesus Christ was the Messiah that they had been waiting for! Yet, they asked for a sign and were rebuked for their unbelief! The three days is talking about how Christ would be raised from the dead 3 days later after He had been crucified. The passage goes on to talk about how Jonah went and preached to the extreme evil Ninevites and even as evil as they were, they finally repented…and how if the ninevites repented, the pharisees and scribes should most certainly realize (since they were students of the law, and even teachers), that Christ is the Messiah, and “a greater than Jonah…” vs. 41.
Also, i think you mentioned in your comment that we have the same God. Am I right?
I don’t see how that could be, unless we both serve a contradicting, moody God, which I know isn’t the case. If your Koran and my Bible say totally different things, like Jesus being the Savior, or not, etc. etc., then how can our Gods be the same? We must admit, our Bibles say totally different things when talking about major issues. If we served the same God, He wouldn’t tell us that salvation through His Son is the way to heaven, but then also say that He didn’t have a son and that to get to heaven you must do all these good things. It just wouldn’t make sense, and that would make our God very confusing, and no one would want to put up with a God like that. I feel like there is so much more I could say, but i know this is already REALLY long! I hope you were able to bear with me! = ) and that it wasn’t confusing…if you have any questions i would love to try and answer them. But whether i can answer every question or not (which i know i cannot answer EVERY one) the one thing i do know is that at one time i was lost, but now I have been saved by the blood of Jesus Christ! He has given me joy and a hope of finally seeing Him face to face!! That, my friend, is what really matters—our eternal destiny-
May 20th, 2006 at 5:50 pm
Took a while to read the entire blog. Whew… Hello Stephanie,and assorted writers.
I am a student of sorts. Self taught type of thing. (James 1:5, Luke 11:19)I am amazed at your knowledge Stephanie. It would be interesting to know where your “Arabia” is? (Reference to Paul’s trip to Arabia Gal 1:15-17)
There is always the quest for truth, even at my senior age. I say, that if then there is truth, then the opposite must also exist, falsehood. The problem we all have is how to tell the difference between truth and falsehood. As a background and FYI, I have studied in depth the Scriptures, LXX, The Greek New Testament, The Qur’an, the 1611 version of the Holy Bible and a few other writings from both sides of the track. But I have no letters earned that I can put before my name or after it either. I have started a new book, “The Analogy of the Two Trains An Apologitic for the Christain and the Muslim Believers” In it is a Chapter concerning the two trains on the same track heading for a collision. Both trains have the correct “right-of-way” to be on the same track. Unfortunately they are headed toward each other and are rapidly heading for a collision. I say that to make my point. As I have read in this blog both trains are blowing their whistles pretty loud!
So, what are we to do?
I do like what C. S. Louis writes in his book, “The Weight of Glory” So then,if we say that there is truth then the opposite must always exist, there is falsehood. How can we then determine the difference between truth and falsehood? Well, for one thing, we must be able to judge, to reason, the whole person judging. C.S. Louis puts it this way, “Now any concrete train of reasoning involves three elements: Firstly, there is the reception of facts to reason about. These facts are received either from our own senses, or from the report of other minds; that is, either experience or authority supplies us with our material. But each man’s experience is so limited that the second source is the more usual; of every hundred facts upon which to reason, ninety-nine depend on authority. Secondly, there is the direct, simple act of the mind perceiving self-evident truth, as when we see that if A and B both equal C, then they equal each other. This act I call intuition. Thirdly, there is an art or skill of arranging the facts so as to yield a series of such intuitions, which linked together produce, a proof of the truth of the propositions we are considering. This in a geometrical proof each step is seen by intuition, and to fail to see it is to be not a bad geometrician but an idiot. The skill comes in arranging the material into a series of intuitable “stepsâ€. Failure to do this does not mean idiocy, but only lack of ingenuity or invention. Failure to follow it need not mean idiocy, but either inattention or a defect of memory which forbids us to hold all the intuitions together.†(C.S. Louis, The Weight of Glory)
I can attest to this myself, that sometime I “can’t see†some self-evident inference, either from some passion which wants me not to see the truth in question or else from laziness. Louis goes on to write, “But when the inability is real (to see the truth or falsehood), argument is at an end. You cannot produce rational intuition by argument, because argument depends upon rational intuition.†When I truly cannot see some self-evident conclusion, line of reasoning comes to an end; there is no comprehension of the rational facts. A person can be trained by practice in attention and in subduing deeply help passions or tainted by the opposite habits. But it is not agreeable to be corrected by argument.
Argument here is defined as presenting a question in which there is a reasonable conclusion. There is an old addage that goes like this, “It is better to debate a question before it is finalized than to finalize a question before it is debated”
In the Christianity Vs Muslim debate, there has been too many questions that have been finalized before the debate. And unfortunately, the finalized answer has now become the “authority” by which now governs. I have read many accouts of “Christians” who changed their way of thinking to become “Muslim” and vice versa. And both sides say the same thing, they have found the “truth”.
So, Ms Stephanie, I am wondering, just how we can change the “rational thinking” of man to behold the truth or recognize falsehood? My opinion is, by the only way that you and I came to know it, By His direct revelation, which was given to Adam first and to the rest of us by the Holy Writ.
I wonder in which “desert” many of the above readers are still in?
God will reveal Himself to only those who are truly seeking Him. As you have said, seeking his face,and I’ll add not his hand, and when he has found the Heavenly Creator, the seeker will find that he was the one being saught after all time. My name is written in the Book of Life. For I believe what you have written is the truth and we concur that there can many, many false religions, but there can only be one correct one. It will be interesting to see you in person when we get over on the other side. When I see Jesus,I’ll ask him where I can find you, and I’m sure He’ll point you out. Looking forward to meeting you. I now call you by a term of endearment…Sister Stephanie
May 20th, 2006 at 6:19 pm
Slight correction, I said that both trains have the “right-of-way” to be on the same track. I should have said both trains “proclaim” to have the correct “right-of-way” for both surely cannot have the same “documents” or else, they would indeed not be two trains on the same track. Sorry
May 21st, 2006 at 9:35 pm
TO KARY:
The favorite Bible story of Jesus’s forgiving the women caught in adultery John 8:3-11 doesn’t belong in the Bible.
“I can simply point out few basic facts that have proved convincing to nearly all scholars of every persuasion: the story is not found in our oldest and best manuscripts of the Gospel of John; its writing style is very different from what we find in the rest of John (including the stories immediately before and after); and it includes a large number of words and phrases that are otherwise alien to the Gospel. The conclusion is unavoidable: this passage was not originally part of the Gospel.†Misquoting Jesus: Page 64-65, Bart D. Ehrman
The crucial point I highlighted about all the codex from which all the holy Bibles are translated from is: NONE OF THE CODEX IS COMING FROM JESUS HIMSELF! This fact places Bible on a critical spot, which you have neglected! The question is how important for the follower of Christianity to have the original and accurate text? In the absence of original Christens are going to end up following the verse like John 8:3-11 which is not even part of Christ’s teaching and they would attribute all the events of John 8:3-11 to God, like you did i.e. False story in the Bible attributed to God and based on that false story God has forgiven the adulterer and the adulteress not to mention disregarding Leviticus 20:10.
Matthew 12:38-40 in which Jesus is comparing his absents of three days and three nights with a live person Jonah! You are explaining…. “No, Jesus was Dead†Should I not listen to Jesus? Rather than any one else, even common sense demands that I should listen to Jesus. It is fine that you can go on and on in your explanations but the question is: Does your explanations and what Jesus is saying in Matthew 12:38-40 has the same value? If so I don’t have any problem to accept your explanations but the reality is far from that. One Bible quotes vs. another Bible quote rather than explanations; will keep the rebuttal apple verses apple.
How many things are you going to defend about the Bible? Let’s take the example of Matthew 12:38-40 one more time. Please remember Jewish lunar calendar system starts from sun set. Christ was put on the cross on Friday (Good Friday). He was brought back from the cross and his body was placed in the holy Sepulcher during the Friday evening. Sunday morning Mary Magdalene went to the holy Sepulcher and the tomb was empty. Now, please count the days and nights in which Jesus was suppose to be in the Tomb? He was in the tomb Saturday night, he was in the tomb Saturday day, he was there Sunday night; and on Sunday morning Mary Magdalene went to the tomb and the tomb was empty! These are two nights and a day. IT IS NOT THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS? Holy Bible and Jesus miscalculated simple counting of three days and three nights!
Christens very salvation depends upon the resurrection of Jesus after death! Neither Christ is saying he was dead for three days and three nights nor the total numbers of days and night are correct in your Bible; is this how Christens will get salvation?
For a moment if we accept John 8:3-11 is related to Jesus then how would you accommodate Matthew 5:17 “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill†Than the question is why not he gave punishment according to the Law of Moses “Adulterer and Adulteress must be stoned to death†Lev 20:10.
There are at least couple of things related to Islam on this page begs little bit more understandings of Islam than what some of you are pitching in. One is relation ship of moon in Islam and the second one is sacrificing of the animals which are a very naïve vision of Islam. Sacrificing of animal is honored in the remembrances of Ibraheem when he was about to sacrify his only son Ismael and the sheep was brought instead. Isaac or Ismael for sacrify? It would be whole other subject that why I would stick to my comments for now. On 10th Ze-Alhujj, Ze-Alhujj is an Islamic month of lunar calendar when Muslims perform pilgrimage to Makkah in which we sacrify animals in the remembrance of the same event when Ibraheem took Ismael for sacrify. The Islamic rule on distribution of meat is one animal’s meat divided into three portions 1st goes to the poor, 2nd goes to relatives and the 3rd for you; purpose of this sacrify is the remembrance of Ibraheem and Ismael and to share food with each other it has nothing to do with salvation!
All doctrines of modern Christianity are made by men: the Trinity, the divine sonship of Jesus, the divinity of Jesus Christ, and the doctrines Original Sin and Atonement. From Jesus’ own sayings, recorded in the New Testament, it is clear that he never claimed divinity or identity with God: “I do nothing of myself” (John 8:28); “My Father is greater than I” (John 14:28; “The Lord our God is one Lord” (Mark 12: 29); “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” (Mark 15:34); and “Father, into Thy hands I commend my spirit” (Luke 23:46); and “But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father” (Mark 13:32).
If Jesus himself said the above in your holy Bible than is there any other authority in this world who can say he is still 100% god? With all my humbleness I would like to say should I listen to him or your explanations?
Gospel according to John 1:1: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”
It is critical to understand that a holy scripture should not contain contradictions. If there are two conflicting verses, then only one can be true or both are wrong, for both cannot be correct for sure.
According to John l: 1 Jesus is God Then how many Gods are there? Two at least; This contradicts many passages in the Bible: Deuteronomy 4:39: “… that the Lord He is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else”; Deuteronomy 6:4: “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord”, (Isaiah 43:10-11): “… that ye may know and believe Me, and understand that I am He: before Me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the Lord; and beside Me there is no savior”; (Isaiah 44:6): “Thus saith the Lord … I am the first, and I am the last, and beside Me there is no God”; (Isaiah 45:18): “For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God Himself that formed the earth and made it; He hath established it, He created it not in vain, He formed it to be inhabited: I am the Lord; and there is none else.”
From Isaiah 45:18 we can conclude that God alone was the Creator and that no one else, not even Jesus, participated in the creation. In case you are interested in quotes from the New Testament than please read the following:
Mark 12:29, where it is recorded that Jesus himself said: “And Jesus answered him: “The first of all the commandments is: Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord.â€
I Corinthians 8:4: “we know That an idol is nothing in the world and that there is none other God but one”; (I Timothy 2:5): “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” Look at the expression “the man Christ Jesus.” Now you can either say that John 1:1 is right and all these other verses are wrong or the other way around.
“We are not good enough to make it to haven†Lets examine what the Bible says about this original sin doctrine.
The Doctrine of Atonement, which was accepted by the Church three or four centuries after Jesus. It contradicts the Bible, as the following passages show: Deuteronomy 24:16: “The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.”; Jeremiah 31:30: “But every one shall die for his own iniquity …”, Ezekiel 18:20: “The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father; neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.” Adam and Eve were responsible for their own sin, which was forgiven by Allah according to the Islamic version.
In case if you are looking for references from the New Testament here are some:
Matthew 7: 1-2. Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.”
I Corinthians 3:8. Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one; and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
Jesus said: ‘Suffer not little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me, for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”
So everybody is born without sin and all children belong to the kingdom of heaven.
Before I go further I would like to emphasis here that I am criticizing the scribe those who changed the Bible not Jesus Peace be upon him. As Muslim you are not Muslim if you don’t believe on Jesus’s miracles, his miracles birth by Virgin Mary, he is the Messiah, and he will come back again. Because of the status of Christ in Islam Christen scholars never disputed the point of common God among Jews, Muslim, and Christens. By the way Catholic respects Quran because of the honor it has given to Mary and Christ.
Here are some sons of God in the Bible i.e. Christ is not the only son in the Bible:
Luke 3:38 Which was [the son] of Enos, which was [the son] of Seth, which was [the son] of Adam, which was [the son] of God. Exodus 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel [is] my son, [even] my firstborn:
Jeremiah 3:19 They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim [is] my firstborn. Psalms 2:7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou [art] my Son; this day have I begotten thee. Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God; they are the sons of God.
Here is what Jesus said about him self in the holy Bible:
Matthew 19:17 “Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is God.â€
Matthew 19:9 “But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of menâ€
Qur’an 14:1
“Alif Laam Raa. A book which we have revealed to you (Muhammad) so that you may lead the people from out of the darknesses into the light by their Lord’s leave to the path of the All-Mighty, the Praiseworthy.”
June 9th, 2006 at 7:24 am
Dear Friends
I stumbled upon this website and posted comments by chance.
Here in South Africa especially here in Durban, it is the home of Mr Ahmed Deedat, the man who challenged Jimmy Swaggart to a debate about 2 decades ago. This video or DVD is now being supplied to all free - The subject of the debate : Is the bible the true word of God?
Although Sheik Deedat has now passed on the DVD or video is still being passed on free of charge.
The reason why I mentioned this is because that one of the writers or commentators above uses some of the Muslim propaganda statements made by Sheik Ahmed Deedat. The DVD or Video has been edited to make the views pro muslim propaganda.
I have also come across Dr Morey’s extensive studies about the crescent moon and star. According to Morey, it dates back to Babylonian times, even up to the time of Abraham (Ebrahim) in Ur of the Chaldees.
There were many worshippers of the sun (RA), moon and stars. The belief system is that the sun and moon got married and their children are the stars.
When Muhammed arrived to Mecca, there where many people worshipping many different Gods.
He made a statement that all these gods are demi-gods and they all report to one main god called Allah (yes, similar to Eli or Eloi).
Muhammed also mentioned that, when you begin your call for prayer (Azaan) - start of with Allah Wakbaar meaning Allah is the greatest - the greatest of all these gods. I could be stoned right here if I had to publicly declare this and be considered as an heretic or infidel. I have been indoctrinated to understand the concept of Jihad - where would our religion of Islam be today if we did not fight for it.
Another aspect of propaganda I was challenged with : The bible and torah mentions that Abraham (Ebrahim) was commissioned bu God to sacrifice his only Son Isaac (Essack)- the son of the spirit counts not the son of the flesh or bondwoman(Hagar/Hajira).
When I mentioned this I was challenged : Are you trying to tell me that our Quran is wrong? - My response : I am not trying to say that your holy book is wrong, all I am trying to say is that what are the possibilities of 2 holy books recording the same incident state that it was Isaac that Abraham had to sacrifice but the quran states that it was Ismael - the seed/descendants of Ismael founded the Islam religion and the seed fo Isaac founded the Jewish religion from which Christianity stems from.
I have been told 2 wrongs (Torah/Bible) do not make a right (Quran).
I have asked many Muslims in SA about the origins of the moon and star on their minarets of the mosques and on Islamic flags, no one could give me an answer - no Imam or Haffez or Moulana.
The internet represents that statement mentioned by one of the people mentioned above but search Dr Morey’s teachings about it on the net and you will find my presentation holds true.
From all the insightful comments from many learned people mentioned here and the debate - type in Dr. Morey moon god - in a search engine and read all about it.
June 9th, 2006 at 3:03 pm
The information that you have posted is completely wrong. I highly advise that you should EDIT your work. Most of what you have posted it a lie, and come on now, your just trying to give Islam a bad name. Isnt a christian should always speak the truth?
Some reading material to open your mind.
Cosmology
Do the unbelievers not realize that the heavens and the earth used to be one solid mass that exploded into existence? And from water we made all living things. Would they believe? [Quran 21:30]
The he turned to the sky, and it had been (as) smoke (dukhaan): He said to it and to the earth: come together, willing or unwillingly. They said: we do come (together) in willing obedience. [Quran 41:11]
The heaven, we have built with power. Verily. We are expanding it. [Quran 51:47]
Evolution
Is it not a fact the there was a time when the human being was nothing to be mentioned? We created the human from a liquid mixture, from two parent, in order to test him. Thus, we made him a hearer and a seer [Quran 76:1-2]
And god created every living creature from water. Some of them walk on their bellies, some walk on two legs, and some walk on four. God create whatever He wills. God is Omnipotent. [Quran 24:45]
Does the human being think that We will not reconstruct his bones? Yes indeed; We are able to recreate his fingerprint. [Quran 75:3-4]
Embryology
What is the matter with you, that you are not conscious of God Majesty. Seeing that it is He that has crated you in diverse stages. [Quran 71:13-14]
He creates you in the womb of your mother, in stages one after another, in three veils of darkness. [Quran 39:6]
… Subsequently, we reproduce him from a tiny drop that is placed into a well protected repository. Then we developed the drop into a hanging (embryo), then developed the hanging (embryo) into a bite-size (fetus) then created the bite-size (fetus) into bones, then covered the bones with flesh. We thus produced a new creature. Most blessed is God, the best Creator. Then, later on, you die. Then, on the Day of Resurrection, you will be resurrected. [Quran 23:12-16]
Geology
When you look at the mountains, you think they are standing still. But they are moving, like the clouds. Such is the manufacture of God. Who perfected everything. He is fully Cognizant of everything you do. [Quran 27:88]
And the mountains as pegs. [Quran 78:7]
And He has set up on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you. [Quran 16:15]
And we sent down Iron, in which is great might, as well as many benefits for mankind. [Quran 57:25]
Have you not seen how God makes the clouds move gently, then joins them together, then makes them into a stack, and then you see rain come out of it…? [Quran 24:43]
Why is it that Islam is the worlds fastest growning religion. And dont try to deny it, its true. Your Western media admits it.
Here are some site that you should visit.
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/scislam.html
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/scislam.html
Islam is a a peaceful and a beautiful religion which I am grateful to Allaah subhana wataala for making me a muslim. No one can be guided except for whom Allaah wills. As muslims we are only try to follow the religion that was passed to human beings by their creator through all the beloved prophets, Adam, Musa, Jesus. I personally i have no hatred, arguments against christians or any other faith for that matter. It Quran it says, lakuum deenikum wali deen(meaning have you religion and i will have mine). Each and every muslim to try their best to be a good muslim by following the true teachings and the sunnah of the prophet(PBUH). Lets not over react when we are angry and show mercy to others especially women and children. As for people saying their are muslims who converted to christianity, its being said that many non-muslims would convert to islam and many would leave in islam because they were not true belivers. May Allaah guide and make us successful both in these world and the hereafter.
June 9th, 2006 at 4:11 pm
You should not correct someone when your wrong. You have know idea what islami about. Do some homework
June 12th, 2006 at 8:13 am
Gentleman
I do uphold the truth.
If you know the Truth, the Truth will set you free - The Truth I am referring to is obviously the Prophet Isa(Jesus). I consider him to be more than just a prophet.
I am interested to know about the Quranic verses quoted above :
The heaven, we have built with power. Verily. We are expanding it. [Quran 51:47]
Evolution
Is it not a fact the there was a time when the human being was nothing to be mentioned? We created the human from a liquid mixture, from two parent, in order to test him. Thus, we made him a hearer and a seer [Quran 76:1-2]
Why does the Quran use the specific word of “WE”
We are expanding or we created or we made him?
With regards to my comments above, I did not mean to offend, I hope you did go through the website I mentioned just to see the differences in opinion.
When the above was discovered by Dr Morey, the people at the university in Saudi was approached for comment, the response was - we are aware of this but cannot make it public knowledge as this would cause more factions/splits within the religion, already there is Sunis, Tabliques, Shi’ites, etc.
One of the university staff have converted to being a Christian and is now in exile, he has written a book about this and his life has been threatened.
As far as the other scriptures mentioned from the Quran :
Christianity embraces the teaching this planet was created by God by speaking forth the word and not by some scientific explanation of the big bang theory. Man and every other creature was created from the dust of the earth (as opposed to water), when any living creature dies they go back into the earth - “earth to earth, dust to dust”
The other aspect which may seem contrary to Islam is that every single person on this planet is born with a purpose and a destiny, it is up to that indiviual to dicover what their purpose or destiny is during their life time on this planet. We call it predestination. It is said that the OMNISCIENT God - OMNI SCIENCE (all knowing God) for knew each and every person throughout the ages and their destinies which He has predestined for them even before the world was created.
Please could you explain the concept of Jihad - what conditions need to be met before a war can be declared a holy war?
June 13th, 2006 at 4:08 am
I have discovered a few websites which may shed some light on the subject at hand :
http://www.bible-koran.com/English/Articles/Isaac_or_Ishmael/isaac_or_ishmael.html
http://www.answering-islam.org/Gilchrist/Vol2/4d.html
The above are the same but the following makes my statements seem too subtle (I do not know how this is going to be taken) :
http://www.africanaquatics.co.za/_christian/_articles/islam_and_the_koran.htm
June 20th, 2006 at 9:15 pm
To Marlon Pillay: In the words of Thomas Carlyle “THEY (The Christians) HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO HATE THE MAN MOHAMED AND HIS RELIGION†is this also a Muslim propaganda?
In the words of George Bernard Shaw about the Holy Bible “THE MOST DANGEROUS BOOK ON EARTH. KEEP IT UNDER LOCK AND KEY†is this also a Muslim propaganda?
In the words of Bart D. Ehrman about the Holy Bible “NOT ONLY DO WE NOT HAVE THE ORIGIONALS, WE DON’T HAVE THE FIRST COPIES OF THE ORIGIONALS. WE DON’T EVEN HAVE COPIES OF THE COPIES OF THE ORIGIONALS, OR COPIES OF THE COPIES OF THE COPIES OF THE ORIGIONALS. WHAT WE HAVE ARE COPIES MADE LATER – IN MOST INSTANCES, THEY ARE COPIES MADE MANY CENTURIES LATER. AND THESE COPIES ALL DIFFER FROM ONE OTHER, IN MANY THOUSAND OF PLACES†is this also a Muslim propaganda?
The Jehovah’s Witness in their “AWAKE†Magazine, dated September, 1957, carried this startling heading – “50,000 ERRORS IN THE BIBLE?†Is this also a Muslim Propaganda.
According to “The Plain Truth†American based Christian Journal under the heading “ THE BIBLE – World’s Most Controversial Book July 1975 “SOME CLAME AND RIGHTLY SO, THAT BIBLICAL PASSAGES HAVE BEEN CONTINUSLY MISUSED AND MISAPPROPRIATED TO JUSTIFY ALMOST EVERY EVIL KNOWN TO MAN†Is this also a Muslim propaganda?
According to Thomas Carlyle “IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD THERE WILL BE NOT AGAIN BE ANY MAN, NEVER SO GREAT, WHOM HIS FELLOWMEN WILL TAKE FOR A GOD. NAY WE MIGHT RATIONALLY ASK, DID ANY SET OF HUMAN BEING EVER REALLY THINK THE MAN THEY SAW THERE STANDING BESIDE THEM A GOD, THE MAKER OF THIS WORLD? PERHAPS NOT: IT WAS USUALLY SOME MAN THEY REMEMBERED, OR HAD SEEN. BUT NITHER CAN THIS ANY MORE BE. THE GREAT MAN IS NOT RECOGNIZED HENCEFORTH AS A GOD ANY MORE†Is this also a Muslim propaganda?
According to Gibbon in his “Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire†THE CREED OF MOHAMED IS FREE FROM THE SUSPICIONS OF AMBIGUITY AND THE KORAN IS A GLORIOUS TESTIMONY TO THE UNITY OF GOD. Is this also a Muslim propaganda?
According to Mahatma Gandhi – The father of modern India “THE MORE I STUDY THE MORE I DISCOVER THAT THE STRENGTH OF ISLAM DOES NOT LIE IN THE SWORD†Is this also a Muslim Propaganda?
Lamartine, “Historie de la Turquie†Paris 1854 “IF GREATNESS OF PURPOSE, SMALLNESS OF MEANS AND ASTOUNDING RESULTS ARE THE THREE CRITERIA OF HUMAN GENIUS, WHO COULD DARE TO COMPARE ANY GREAT MAN IN MODERN HISTORY WITH MOHAMMED? PHILOSOPHER, ORATOR, APOSTLE, LEGISLATOR, WARRIOR, CONQUEROR OF IDEAS, RESTORER OF RATIONAL BELIEVES OF TWENTY TERRESTRIAL EMPIRES AND OF ONE SPRITUAL EMPIRE THAT IS MOHAMMED. AS REGARDS ALL STANDAREDS BY WHICH HUMAN GREATNESS MAY BE MEASURED, WE MAY WELL ASK, IS THERE ANY MAN GREATER THEN HE? Is this also a Muslim Propaganda?
CRICENT AND THE FLAG:
Saudi Arabia is the most important Islamic country and it doesn’t have crescent or the moon on their flag.
Indonesia is the largest Islamic country it doesn’t have crescent or moon on their flag. INCLUDING SAUDI ARABIA AND INDONESIA FOLLOWING ARE THE OTHER ISLAMIC COUNTRIES WHICH DON’T HAVE CRICENT OR MOON ON THEIR FLAG THESE COUNTRIES TOTALS FOR THE MAJORITY OF THE MUSLIM POPULATIONS AROUND THE GLOBE: Afghanistan, Bangaladesh, Iran, Jordan, Kuwait, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Lebanon, Morocco, Niger, Nigeria, Oman, Qatar, Somalia, Sudan, Tajikistan, Tanzania, United Arab Emirates, Yemen, Albania, Bahrain, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Brunei, Egypt, Mali, Libya, Palestine, Syria etc. (I’ve listed only countries which has majority of Muslim population).
ISSAC OR ISMAEL:
At any given time Ishmael was the ONLY SON of Ibrahim Isaac can not be the ONLY SON at any given time for Ibrahim.
Genises 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine ONLY [SON] Isaac, whom thou lovest …
Genesis 17:24-27: “And Abraham was ninety years old and nine when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. And Ishmael his son was thirteen years old, when he was circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin. In the selfsame day was Abraham circumcised, and Ishmael his son. And all the men of his house, born in the house, and bought with money of the stranger, were circumcised with him.”
A year later, Isaac was born and circumcised when he was eight days old:
Genesis 21:4-5: “And Abraham circumcised his son Isaac being eight days old, as God had commanded him. And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born unto him.” So when the covenant was made and sealed (circumcision and sacrifice) Abraham was ninety nine and Ishmael was thirteen. Isaac was born a year later, when Abraham was one hundred years old.
The Islamic version states that the covenant between God, Abraham, and his only son Ishmael was made and sealed when Ishmael was supposed to be sacrificed. On the very same day, Abraham, Ishmael, and all the men of Abraham’s household were circumcised. At that time, Isaac had not even born!
The descendants of Ishmael, Prophet Muhammad including all Muslims, remain faithful until today to this covenant of circumcision. In their five daily prayers, Muslims include the praise of Abraham and his descendants with the praise of Muhammad and his descendants.
REGARDING “WEâ€
In most Eastern languages “We†is used as a respect of plural e.g. Hebrew is an Eastern language in which God is referred as “El†and as “Elohim†‘im’ is the respect of plural. In Hebrew language God remains one either as “El†or “Elohim†I speak Urdu language and in Urdu I referred myself ‘we’ many times, it still remains I myself. For example if you watch some Indian Hindi movies where Kings or Mongols Kings were shown, they rarely use the word “I†when they referred their selves instead they mostly use “We†In case if you are unknowingly trying to equate Quranic “We†with trinity than following is the Quranic stand on trinity:
Quran 5:73 They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
WHAT IS JIHAD?
Jihad is an Arabic word it means “Struggle†This word cover broader area here are some of it: Struggle could be to achieve freedom, peace or resist against the enemy. When a women or men hold on to their righteousness specially in today’s time, it is a Jihad. I would say resistance against every ill is Jihad.
I like to clarify, and emphasize again and again that any Muslim including Muslim scholars can not, I mean literally can not demean Jesus or any Prophet peace be upon them all. Doing so will be violation of Islamic teachings that’s why people in Islamic world don’t even try to violate it. When we Muslims criticize Christianity, our one and only intention is that, Bible was changed and we have been saying this for last fourteen hundred years, there are plenty of evidences available which are acknowledged by Christian Scholars themselves.
We Muslims would like to say this humbly that we are the one who are imitating Christ in our daily lives and prayers not the Christens and here are some examples of it:
Mathew 26:39 And he (Jesus) went a little further, and FELL ON HIS FACE, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou [wilt].
Numbers 20:6 And Moses and Aaron went from the presence of the assembly unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, and they FELL UPON THEIR FACES: and the glory of the LORD appeared unto them.
Genesis 17:3 And Abram FELL ON HIS FACE: and God talked with him …..
Who fell on their faces and pray? Christen or Muslims?
Jesus pbuh greeted people with the greetings of “Peace be upon you†We Muslims use the same greeting when we meet each other “Salam-o-Alikum†which means, Peace be upon you.
June 21st, 2006 at 7:23 am
Malaikum Salaam Azim Quadir,
You have earned my respect for being a scholar of the Quran as well as of the Bible.
If you study any religious book without the proper background and history of the time but just as a critic, guess what, you will find what you are looking for.
I must admit, I have not fully read the Quran, but parts of it and am not familiar with the background to Islam, as you might have guessed, therefore I have asked questions.
When studying any religious book we must be careful to observe the following :
A TEXT OUT OF CONTEXT IS PRE-TEXT.
The Plain Truth, Jehovah’s Witnesses (Watchtower), Mahatma Gandhi, Thomas Carlyle, George Bernard Shaw and some of the other peoples comments mentioned are their own personal convictions of people, their comments do not bother me. Whatever they studied and understood as being their revelation can become their truth as well.
I refuse to be deviated from the Truth, anything contrary to the Word of God is not truth but others opinions.
If I was a famous person or well educated person (with Phd) and made a statement : That man evolved from an ape, I would have many people who reads about my theories following my theories and claiming it as “gospel”.
I obviously do not subscribe to the theory of evolution - as it is a theory which cannot be proven, irrespective of the Professors who have found Mrs Ples in South Africa’s Cradle of Humanity.
It does not matter how anglicised the persons name may sound but that does not make them a true follower of the Christian faith.
The whole of the Bible is truly recorded but it is not necessarily a statement of truth.
Example : When Job said : The lord giveth and the lord taketh away.
Many think that this is a statement of truth from God, but it is merely man’s statement which is truly recorded but not a statement of truth.
Just as Islam have different sects so too does Christianity have different sects, people making statements from the different sects and their beliefs, would cause doubt and negativity on the truth, therefore mis-appropriating the truth.
Please do not misunderstand me, I was not mentioning the crescent moon and star/s on the flag, the flag is not important but the original idea mentioned (also by the websites, I have mentioned).
I understand a bit of the eastern traditions : Your first born son would inherit your business or family trust.
But the Bible mentioned “take Isaac your only son” merely because it is the son that God promised Abraham. Sarai decided out of her own fleshly will to help God with his promise and give her slave Hagar to Abraham to have children with. Yes Ishmael is the first born but Isaac was the one God promised to give to Abraham, God did not Hagar to help Him with His promise that he made to them.
If you had to leave a will for your family, you would leave it to your son/daughter not to the children of your servant.
Similarly, God does not need me to defend Him - He has told me this several times (God speaks to me). Yes, in the past there were men who made decisions based on their flesh and said it was from God. They used God as an excuse to promote their agenda’s - some of this would include colonisation, extend their countries wealth, trade reasons - Spice trade which started in the 16th century after man learnt that the earth is no longer flat and that they can sail beyond a particular spot without falling off the earth.
I understand FALLING ON THE GROUND before God.
I have studied several methods of worship positions before God.
Just like David (Dawood) did :
He danced before God, he flirted with God by writing him poetry and songs(psalms), he played his harp and sang to God, he blew him kisses as if he was infatuated with God.
God saw this and poured his favour on him.
God could have said :
He is young but I do not care, I love his attitude I will make him king, He has no protocol but I will make him King, he has no education (just a shapherd boy) but I am going to make him King. This is God’s favour and blessing upon you.
I do understand that God is one, I firmly believe this. God is a God of multiplication.
1 x 1 x 1 = 1 In Genesis whatever he created, He blessed and said go and multiply.
The chrsitian concept of a triune God can be explained by WATER (H2O)
Water (H2O) exists in 3 phases solid (ice), liquid (water) and gas (water vapour).
Whatever form you encounter H2O on it is still water in a form.
Similarly God is a spirit not a human being but permitted a part of Him to come to earth in human form (we call this incarnation - God becoming flesh) to show us a new and living way - the way of the kingdom not the law.
The Old testament was law - following the 10 commandments which no one can follow, to show us that we have no choice but to rely on God and not in our own strength.
Then came Jesus on the scene at the right appointed time to show us the way of the kingdom, no longer under the law.
I do not have to go to a physical building to fellowship with God, i can fellowship with God where ever I am, if I meet with an accident and land in a bush, I am no longer under the law to wash myself first before I commune with God.
I am no longer under the law to circumcise my flesh (old testament) but it is now circumcision of the heart(spirit).
Once you have a revelation or encounter with the almighty God as I have there is no turning back.
Once your heart or spirit has been circumcised you do not have any desires but to worship and serve the Almighty only. You dedicate and commit your life to Him.
You have to have an encounter with God, a personal experience it is indescribable.
You will understand what it truly means to be free, no longer under the law (women included).
We are spiritual beings, if we die our earth suite the body remains to go into the ground but our spirit lives on. God is a spirit and communicates to us via our spirit, you commune with Him in a spiritual realm.
I know anyone reading this will not easily understand what I am saying in the natural, this may sound like a fairy tale or some spaced out experience. NO - If you have had my experience of survivng an accident close to death and then knowing the true God, knowing your true purpose in life and finding your destiny. You will experience the love of God.
I invite you to accept this Christ and experience this feeling.
June 25th, 2006 at 10:02 pm
To Marlon Pillay: It is Walikum Asalam not Malikum Asalam, thanks anyway.
Your experience of this true love is irrelevant to the subject we are talking about. You have placed some charges on Muslims on your first comments; you have to remember it, if you can not remember it please read it back, also please have the patience to listen to the response rather than explaining and invoking your own experience of life.
Your comments about the great thinkers, mostly Christens thinker of the past and present is the following “The Plain Truth, Jehovah’s Witnesses (Watchtower), Mahatma Gandhi, Thomas Carlyle, George Bernard Shaw and some of the other peoples comments mentioned are their own personal convictions of people, their comments†Than what do you think where your own comments and experience of life will stands?
Your comments “You have earned my respect for being a scholar of the Quran as well as of the Bible.†At the same time you are saying this:
“When studying any religious book we must be careful to observe the following: “A TEXT OUT OF CONTEXT IS PRE-TEXT.†i.e. You are giving respect and at the same time lowering it down by educating what is a text and context.
In order not to misunderstand your comments it would be important for you to remain in one area of the discussion and avoid invoking evolution theory and etc, since it is understood that all religions of the world have the same point of view on evolution theory.
My question to you is can Isaac be the ONLY son to Abraham at any given time? Is it possible for human intellect to accept Isaac as first born while Ishmael was the first born? Can God do such things according to your Bible calling first born as second born? Or Isaac as first born in the Bible is the insertion created by scribes later on; which Christians took it as a word of God just like they did with many interpolated verses of the Bible?
If singing and dancing is the method of prayers adopted by different prophets than why not Jesus did the same method of prayer on the most important occasion of his life, at the garden of Gethsemane?
Mathew 26:39 And he (Jesus) went a little further, and FELL ON HIS FACE, and prayed …
Where in the Bible God has referred Himself with H2O? In case if you are able to find this quote in your Bible than would you please explain electrons, protons neutrons, and their different properties as well? Will it consider part of molecule or not? Once you have the above information you are still going to end up explaining Weak Force, and the String Theory as a part of molecular property.
Once you begin to take your life’s own experience normally than please learn about other properties of water e.g. at four degree centigrade water has the maximum density; how would you accommodate this property of water with your idea of God? Or you didn’t even know that there are other properties of water? I would suggest you it is not such a brilliant idea to equate God with water’s property.
Max Plank spends all his life in the research of atom and its properties. While receiving his Noble Prize in his speech he said:
“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force… We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind. This Mind is the matrix of all matter.â€
OBVIOUSLY, FOR YOU THIS IS JUST AN OPINION; by the way Max Plank’s description about “Intelligent Mind behind the Matrix of
Matter†would have been a better choice to equate God than the best you have been able to explain so far.
The only verses in the whole Bible that explicitly ties God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit in one “Triune” being is the verse of 1 John 5:7.
“For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
This verse is now universally recognized as being a later “insertion” of the Church and all recent versions of the Bible, such as the Revised Standard Version the New Revised Standard Version, the New American Standard Bible, the New English Bible, the Phillips Modern English Bible etc. have all unceremoniously expunged this verse from their pages. Why is this? Please explain? Or this concept of trinity was just another opinion?
You have explained few things related to Torah and the Law. Is this your own experience and explainations? Christians claim that Bible is the word of God cover to cover and it is inerrant, would it not be more appropriate to respond from your Word of God rather than your own experience? My understanding is that in Christianity Bible is the word of God and its contents has the highest precedence over any one’s experience and explanations.
You said “Then came Jesus on the scene at the right appointed time to show us the way of the kingdom, no longer under the law.†Contrary to your statement see what Jesus is saying in your Bible.
Jesus said: “Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.†Matthew 5:17
It is quite interesting to know about Christians that God talks to them regularly. Eastern part of the world which is much more spiritual than the western world where Buddhist, Hindus, Muslims and other faith have given birth to great mystical people even they never claim that they talk to God like Christians do. This is also quite interesting that these Christens who talk to God regularly their own countries is full of Alcoholics, Gamblers, Nudity and Pornography, have Pork in there regular diet i.e. complete violation of the Biblical Teachings and yet God talk to these Christians regularly, AMAZING.
You said “I am no longer under the law to circumcise my flesh (Old Testament) but it is now circumcision of the heart (spirit).â€
Answer to this is coming from your own Bible if you believe Jesus own words in Mathew 5:17.
Genesis 17:13-14
He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised: and my covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant.
June 26th, 2006 at 9:42 pm
I Corinthians 2:14
“But the natural man [unbeliever] receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”
June 28th, 2006 at 7:20 am
Azim
Genesis does refer to foreskin circumcision, so does most of the old testament, but as I mentioned the Old Testament is all about The Law and practising law and rituals. Under the new testament it is circumcision of the heart. I do not expect many people to believe that, just like the parables are not understood by all.
Yes Jesus did say that he did not come to abolish the law but to fulfill. I and some of the people who attribute to this new understanding is that Jesus has come to introduce the KINGDOM concept. A bit difficult to explain all of it on this site.
I am referring to all new testament scriptures that refer to KINGDOM - the same dominion and authority Adam and Eve had when they were created. They did not have time to fully explore their full potential as being a king on their kingdom - this planet earth, but Jesus demonstrated a few kingdom principles when he walked on water, raised certain dead people, healed the sick, commanded the weather to change, etc. I am now starting to understand my kingdom rights and practise such and attempt to do same. No, I have not walked on water yet or raised any from the dead yet but I am starting to understand my authority and dominion on this planet. I am starting to believe that my body can glow with the glory (transfigure) just like Adam and Eve before they sinned and realised they were naked.
Yes, I know this might be too spiritual to understand but this is the kingdom teaching it is not for the faint hearted, most people/”christians” would probably not believe any of this because they try to understand spiritual truths with human understanding.
Example: The number 40 mentioned in the bible refers to a period of testing or trials - Moses led the Israelites 40 years in the desert (desert experience), Jesus was led by the spirit for 40 days in the wilderness to be tempted.
There is scripture mentioning specifically to this but this is spiritually discerned.
Ismael was Abrahams first born, Isaac was second born. We all know that, God knew that but when the bible mentions “your only son Isaac” it is the son God promised Abraham and refers to that son. You can read the whole account again and refer to my previous explanation of how Sarai decided to help God with her own decision.
As I also mentioned previously if I was a prominent person my revelations would probably cause a following, but I am not a person of note, and the kingdom revelation teachings are only for those who can see with their spiritual eyes (spiritual perception).
I still stick to my original statement :
A text out of context is pre-text.
The Qumran scrolls or dead sea scrolls that were recently found, preserved by the Essenes at the time of Christ when translated into English shows us that the Bible was translated correctly, give or take a few translation errors due to the language differences.
Example : In english there was no word for BAPTISE so the translaters transliterated the word, substituted english letters for the greek ones and came up with the word BAPTISE.
There are many faults in any religious book, Torah, Bible even the Quran.
I do not want to tackle that on line.
June 28th, 2006 at 12:06 pm
One of the many divine qualities of the Bible is that it does not yield its secrets to the irreverent and the censorious. –James I. Packer
The Bible is no mere book, but a Living Creature, with a power that conquers all that oppose it. –Napoleon
Hebrews 4:12: “For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”
July 10th, 2006 at 10:15 pm
THE KING JAMES VERSION HAS WITH GOOD REASON BEEN TERMED ‘THE NOBLEST MONUMENT OF ENGLISH PROSE.’ ITS REVISERS IN 1881 EXPRESSED ADMIRATION FOR ITS SIMPLICITY, ITS DIGNITY, ITS POWER IT’S HAPPY TURNS OF EXPRESSION THE MUSIC OF ITS CADENCES, AND THE FELICITIES OF ITS RHYTHM.’ IT ENTRED, AS NO OTHER BOOK HAS, INTO THE MAKING OF THE PERSONAL CHARACTER AND THE PUBLIC INSTITUTION OF THE ENGLISH SPEAKING PEOPLE WE OWE TO IT AN INCALCULABLE DEBET “YET THE KING JAMES VERSION HAS GRAVE DEFECT.†AND THAT THESE DEFECTS ARE SO MANY AND SO SERIOUS AS TO CALL FOR REVISION.
PREFACE OF RSV 1971 PAGE III
Above is written on the preface of Christen Holy Bible. This preface is the work of the learned men of Christianity. I assume they were more learned than Napoleon.
“For there are three bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Gost: and these three are one.†1st Epistle of John 5:7 AV
And the Spirit is the witness, because the Spirit is the truth. 1st Epistle of John 5:7 RSV
By the way by changing John 5:7 in RSV Christians are one step closer to Islam.
CONTRIDICTIONS IN THE BIBLE:
THREE YEARS FAMINE OR SEVEN YEARS FAMINE?
II Samuel 24:13 So Gad came to David, and told him, and said unto him, Shall seven years of famine come unto thee in thy land? or wilt thou flee three months before thine enemies, while they pursue thee?
I Chronicles 21:11-12 So Gad came to David, and said unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Choose thee. Either three years’ famine; or three months to be destroyed before thy foes, while that the sword of thine enemies overtaketh thee;
JEHOIACHIN WAS EIGHT YEARS OR EIGHTY YEARS OLD?
II Chronicles 36:9 Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did [that which was] evil in the sight of the LORD.
II King 24:8 Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother’s name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.
TWO THOUSAND BATHS OR THREE THOUSAND BATHS?
I King 7:26 And it [was] an hand breadth thick, and the brim thereof was wrought like the brim of a cup, with flowers of lilies: it contained two thousand baths.
II Chronicles 4:5 And the thickness of it [was] an handbreadth, and the brim of it like the work of the brim of a cup, with flowers of lilies; [and] it received and held three thousand baths.
SEVEN HUNDRED OR SEVEN THOUSAND?
II Samuel 10:18 And the Syrians fled before Israel; and David slew the men of seven hundred chariots of the Syrians, and forty thousand horsemen, and smote Shobach the captain of their host, who died there.
I Chronicles 19:18 But the Syrians fled before Israel; and David slew of the Syrians seven thousand men which fought in chariots, and forty thousand footmen, and killed Shophach the captain of the host.
FOUR THOUSAND OR FORTY THOUSAND?
II Chronicles 9:25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
1 Kings 4:26 And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.
The Jews did not use the “0″ (Zero) in the Old Testament. According to Christian Holy Bible the difference between 40 thousand and 4 thousand is only 36 thousand. Muslim’s question to the Christians is: WHO WAS THE REAL AUTHOR OF THIS STAGGERING DISCREPANCY OF 36000? WAS IT GOD OR MAN?
Christians are coming forward and pleaded their confession in the following way. Those who still think that Bible is the word of God cover to cover they should at least listen to their own learned man.
Weather it is witting or unwitting, the “inspired†writer’s singular inability to grasp the difference between 2000 and 3000 is unforgivable. It is an obvious contradiction. “AND NO MIRACLE WOULD PROVE THAT TWO AND TWO MAKES FIVE, OR THAT A CIRCLE HAS FOUR ANGLES; AND NO MIRACLES, HOWEVER NUMEROUS COULD REMOVE A CONTRIDICTION WHICH LIES ON THE SURFACE OF THE TEACHINGS AND RECORDS OF CHRISTIANITY.†Albert Schweizer “In Search of the Historical Jesus†Page 22
Mrs. Ellen. G White a “prophetess†of the Seventh Day Adventist Church, in her Bible Commentary V, 1, Page 14 said.
“The Bible we read today is the work of many copyists who have in most instances done their work with marvelous accuracy. But copyists have NOT BEEN INFALLIBLE, and God most evidently has NOT SEEN FIT to preserve them altogether FROM ERROR in transcribing.â€
Dr. Joseph Parker for his unique eulogy of the Bible:
“What a book is the Bible in the matter of verity of contents! Whole pages taken up with obscure names and more is told of a genealogy than of the Day of Judgment. Stories are half told, and the night falls before we can tell where victory lay. Where is there anything.â€
“THERE ARE TEXTUAL DIFFICULTIES WITH WHICH
SCHOLARS ARE STILL WRESTLING. ONLY A BIBLE ILLITRATE WOULD DENY THESE AND OTHER PROBLEMS.†The Plain Truth, July 1975.
The level of interpolation Bible contained, how can it is possible that Genesis 2:22 where ONLY SON is mention is not interpolated? Or for That matter other verses those are corner stones of Christianity has not been
Interpolated?
While Christian Scholars are admitting their selves that Bible was interpolated the
exponentially big question is: What the verdict is for those who have changed the Scripture?
This verdict is in the Quran about those who changed the scripture (Torah and the
Gospel) for their own benefit:
Holy Quran 2:79 AND WOE TO THOSE WHO WRITE THE BOOK WITH THEIR OWN HAND AND THEN SAY: “THIS IS FROM ALLAH.†TO TRAFFIC WITH IT FOR A MISERABLE PRICE! SO WOE TO THEM FOR WHAT THEIR HANDS DO WRITE AND WOE TO THEM FOR WHAT THEY EARN THEREBY!
July 11th, 2006 at 8:43 pm
John 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
July 21st, 2006 at 11:14 pm
~~Jesus loves you~~
“Know therefore this day, and consider it in thine heart, that the Lord he is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else.”-Deut 4:39
August 12th, 2006 at 8:46 pm
I think you need to do some more research. You are meshing “Islam” with “Muslims.” While those that follow Islam are called Muslims, TRUE Muslims don’t reflect all the fundamentalistic ideas your page states they do. Also, “Allah” is the Arabic translation of God. If you spoke a language other than English, you would call God something else too. Muslims believe in the same God that Christians believe in. You may want to speak with some true Muslims before you cloud the internet with more uneducated blasphemy.
follow-up sent Aug. 14, 2006…
Stephanie,
Thanks for writing. The real problem today is that too many people associate Islam with Muslims. Of course, those that follow Islam are called Muslims but the people that truly represent the ideals of Islam will tell you that there are Muslims in the world who do crazy things in the name of their religion and have hijacked the principles and beliefs. True Muslims have said for centuries that the God they worship is the same God that Christians and Jews worship–the God of Abraham. Islam is an “Abrahamic religion” and Allah is simply a personal word for God. It would be like you and I calling God “Father” or “Heavenly Father” or “Master” or calling Jesus “Savior.” True Muslims also love and accept Jesus. They believe that He was one of the greater messengers of God and when they pray, true Muslims pray for Jesus and his return to this earth. They believe he is the Messiah. The only real difference in Islam and Christianity, aside from the un-important rituals, is the fact the Muslims do not associate human characteristics with God, therefore…they do not believe Jesus is the son of God. Sure, I find this hard to believe but I am trying to learn more about this. Muslims, true Muslims I should say, read the Bible. I know many true Muslims who know much more about the Bible and the life of Jesus than I do and I am a Christian. Much of this has to do with the fact that Islam came much later than Christianity and is considered to tie everything together that was left untied by previous “religions of the book.”
True Muslims fast as they feel that sacrificing something for God is an important reminder that He is continually making sacrifices for us–Christians do this too. True Muslims give alms to the poor as God calls them to help those persons that are less fortunate than they are. True Muslims will tell you that the 5 prayers, the pilgrimage, the veils, the ablutions…are not 100% necceesary –they simply are an addition to the true faith.
I would like to share this link with you: http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/
It’s a great site that USC has put together to answer questions about Islam and the various similarites and differences in relgion. Check out the bio of the Prophet Muhammed. I think you will be impressed with the type of person he was.
Thanks for writing.
Nathan
August 18th, 2006 at 8:57 pm
“True Muslims fast as they feel that sacrificing something for God is an important reminder that He is continually making sacrifices for us–Christians do this too”
I’m just curious–since I don’t know very much about “Allah”–but what sacrifices has he made for muslims?
I know what sacrifices the God of Christianity has made for me.
August 21st, 2006 at 7:59 am
Kari
I have just starting embracing the Kingdom teaching and from that perspective, even some mainstream Christian followers still practice some meaningless rituals which they feel will have an impact on god and change his mind or earn brownie points.
Face it even if you pray 100 times a day with worry beads or whatever you may call it and you do not hear from God, then your prayer is a monologue and not a dialogue.
Some even fast invain and that might be a dieting method instead of the actual idea of the fast.
Yes, I see your point.
August 23rd, 2006 at 12:35 pm
Hey thanks for the reply!
The only time my prayers are monologues are the times when I do all the talking and don’t sit still and allow the Holy Spirit to speak, too.
I’ve also found that the times when I don’t think God is listening are the times when I’m wandering from Him, or have some unconfessed sin in my life. It’s not that He just doesn’t want to listen. God is always ready to listen…and to speak, if we would just let Him.
and just a side note: I was just wondering if the “worry beads” you were talking about were supposed to be the Rosaries (or however you spell them) that catholics use when they pray. Just in case, I want to say that I’m not a catholic…and Christianity does not equal Catholicism. They are extremely different when you get down to doctrine. I just don’t want you to think that they are the same, (just in case you did think that)
Have a great day!
August 24th, 2006 at 8:57 am
Dave
Interesting topic… I’m working in this industry myself and I don’t agree about this in 100%, but I added your page to my bookmarks and hope to see more interesting articles in the future
November 2nd, 2006 at 2:47 am
CONTRIDICTIONS IN THE BIBLE:
THREE YEARS FAMINE OR SEVEN YEARS FAMINE?
JEHOIACHIN WAS EIGHT YEARS OR EIGHTY YEARS OLD?
TWO THOUSAND BATHS OR THREE THOUSAND BATHS?
SEVEN HUNDRED OR SEVEN THOUSAND?
FOUR THOUSAND OR FORTY THOUSAND?
Holy Quran 2:79 AND WOE TO THOSE WHO WRITE THE BOOK WITH THEIR OWN HAND AND THEN SAY: “THIS IS FROM ALLAH.†TO TRAFFIC WITH IT FOR A MISERABLE PRICE! SO WOE TO THEM FOR WHAT THEIR HANDS DO WRITE AND WOE TO THEM FOR WHAT THEY EARN THEREBY!
If I can recall correctly Muhammed was illiterate and did not write the quran, his wife’s relative wrote it for him.
Besides the quran has just as much contradictions as the bible (mentioned above).
Besides these small discrepancies do not affect my salvation and belief.
Whether people dip, drown or sprinkle during a water baptism does not really bother me.
According the bible : “If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus Christ and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, then you are saved.”
The small indifferences in between an extra 0 or numbers does not bother me as long as the a person believes in their heart and confess with their mouth - they are saved - born again.
November 2nd, 2006 at 3:23 am
Hi Stephanie,
Thank you for allowing me this opportunity to state my opinion or beliefs. I am a Christian. I do not understand Arabic, so I collect every English translation of the Quran I can get to see how Muslims understand interpret the meaning of their holy book. I mean, what good is a book, whether Bible or Quran, if I don’t understand its teachings. So back to Islam. I studied Islam by reading these various translations and explanations or commentaries by Muslims. I know it is hard for humans to hear the truth about their faith [Christianity, Islam, etc…] and to stay calm. I accept that you, the readers and myself are adults and will read my comments objectively.
Lets look at your examples:
First the Arabic word “Allah” is actually “al-lah”: Al meaning “The” and lah meaning “God” Lah can also mean “god” - so the context is important. God is not God’s name, god is not gods name and Allah is not Allah’s name.
Muhammad was an Arab and had no choice but to address his Deity as “Allah” - Just like I have no choice but to address my Deity as “God”.
I prefer not to use the Catholic term “Trinity” - you will not deviate from true Christianity and the Bible if you stick to the term “One God” - This term was used by God Himself in the Holy Bible, by His prophets and apostles. The term “Trinity” is not found in the Bible, at lease, the Bible translators were honest to leave this term out of the pages/text of the English Bible. But can the same be said about the Quran Translators. Some were honest to leave it out since the term “Trinity” was not found in the Arabic text of the Quran, but some, majority were tempted and could not withstand the temptation, they just had to add it to the English translations.
There is but One God only. Now the concept of this One God is where we need to focus on. The Biblical One God is not three persons but three manifestations of the same God. Father, Son and Holy Spirit is One Person but different Attributes. Okay, now I just made a lot of Christians angry. But this is Bible. Now lets compare the Muslim God or Allah if you prefer. Allah made/created Adam and breath into Adam of Allah’s Spirit. This does not mean Allah and His Spirit are two persons. Jesus is the Word of Allah that was made human in Mary. God, His Spirit and Word is not three persons but three attributes of The God - Allah. Okay, now the Muslims are angry with me.
The Graet Apostle Paul preached that God that God is faithful [Holy Bible - 1 Cor. 10:13 & 2 Tim. 2:13]. But Muhammad preached that Allah deceives [The Noble Quran 4:142] Now Abdul Yusuf Ali was embarrassed about this verse and translated the Arabic word “khadi” as “over-reaching” but in Quran 2:9 where the same Arabic Word appears, he translated it correctly. Muhammad also preached that Allah is a misleader [The Noble Quran 14:4] Now, again Ali was embarrassed about this verse and translated it as “Allah leaves them to stray” Oh! this is of course his first edition and in his second edition it reads “Allah leads astray” There is a difference in leaving someone to stray and to lead someone astray. This is one reason why I can’t accept Islam and the Quran, I can’t believe God to be “khadi - deceiver”.
To be honest - while Allah does not forgive shirk - idol worship, God also does not forgive blaspheming the Holy Spirit. So we better watch it.
The Apostle Paul preached that God loves the sinner but hates the sin, Muhammad preached that Allah hates both sinner and sin [Quran 2:190] - So if you sinned or transgressed today - Allah loveth not the transgressor. I can not accept this god of the Quran as “The God” of our beloved Apostle Paul.
The Bible teaches against divorce but the Quran 33:37 promoted it so that Muhhamd could marry his adopted son’s ex-wife.
The Bible teaches that divorced couples must re-unite with no conditions attached — the Quran 2:230 teaches that if a husband and wife divorced and want to re-unite, the ex-wife must first get married to another man and if that second husband divorce her, then only may she go back to the first husband - Muhammad preached here — Sahih AL-Bukhari Vol. 7, Hadith 715 page 479 “Narrated Ikrima: Rifaa divorced his wife whereupon Abdur-Rahman married her. Aisha said that the lady… complained to her and showed a GREEN SPOT ON HER SKIN CAUSED BY BEATING. It was the habit of ladies to support each other, so when Allah’s messenger came, Aisha said, I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY WOMAN SUFFERING AS MUCH AS THE BELIEVING WOMEN. Look! Her skin is greener than her clothes! When Abdur-Rahman heard that his wife had gone to the prophet, he came with his two sons from another wife. She said, By Allah! I have done no wrong to him, but he is impotent… Abdur-Rahman said… O Allah’s messenger! She has told a lie [that I am impotent]… BUT SHE IS DISOBEDIENT and wants to go back to Rifaa. ALLAH’S MESSENGER SAID TO HER: IF THAT IS YOUR INTENTION [TO GO BACK TO RIFAA YOUR FIRST HUSBAND], THEN KNOW THAT IT IS UNLAWFUL FOR YOU TO [DIVORCE ABDUR AND TO] REMARRY RIFAA UNLESS ABDUR-RAHMAN HAS HAD SEXUAL INTERCOURSE WITH YOU.” Image, you and your wife divorce and to re-unite, she must first marry another man, have hot sex with him before she becomes lawful to me. I can not accept Islam and the Quran, thanks God I am a Christian.
Hope the few examples gave some light between the two religions and there books and apostles.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Brother Michael Mahomed
November 2nd, 2006 at 7:35 am
Hi Nathan,
TRUE MUSLIMS
Lets first define what is a true Muslim? If you [generally speaking] fit the description, than you are a true Muslim, right? IfI am wrong, well I am human and is ready to learn, I don’t mean ready to swallow anything.
Now, a true Muslim will be one who believes in the Quran and practices what the Quran requires, right?
Lets see if the fanatics are true Muslims!
A TRUE Muslim is someone who does not ask for peace when having power over another being. The Noble Quran 47:35 “So be not weak and ASK NOT FOR PEACE (FROM THE ENEMIES OF ISLAM), WHILE YOU ARE HAVING THE UPPER HAND…” Introduction to English translation of Sahih Bukhari, p.xxiv “Allah … commanded the Muslims to fight against all the Pagans as well as against the people of the Scriptures (Jews and Christians) if they do not embrace Islam, till they pay the Jizia (a tax levied on the Jews and Christians) with willing submission and feel themselves subdued (as it is revealed in Quran 9:29). So the Muslims were not permitted to abandon “the fighting” against them (Pagans, Jews and Christians) and to reconcile with them and to suspend hostilities against them for an unlimited period while they are STRONG and have the ability to fight against them. So at first “the fighting†was forbidden, then it was permitted and after that it was made obligatory.†So a TRUE muslim must only ask for peace when they are weak. No wonder Muhammad preached peace [Quran 2:256] when he first started off with his so-called prophethood, but when he became strong, he introduced the sword. Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 9:29 “FIGHT THOSE WHO BELIEVE NOT
i. In Allah nor
ii. the Last Day, nor
iii. hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and his apostle, nor
iv. acknowledge the religion of truth (even if they are) of the people of the book…â€
A TRUE muslim is someone who will kill those muslims who leaves Islam and join Christianity. The Noble Quran 4:89 “They wish that you REJECT FAITH, AS THEY HAVE REJECTED (FAITH) and thus that you all become equal. So take not Auliya (protectors or friends) from them, till they emigrate in the way of Allah. BUT IF THEY TURN BACK (FROM ISLAM) TAKE (HOLD OF THEM) AND KILL THEM wherever you find themâ€
So far it looks like the fanatics are the true Muslims.
A TRUE muslim must not have Christian and Jewish friends - Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 5:54 “O ye who believe! TAKE NOT THE JEWS AND THE CHRISTIANS FOR YOUR FRIENDS AND PROTECTORS: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he who turns to them (for friendship) is of them…†So if a Muslim turn to a Christian for friendship, then he the Muslim is like him the Christian.
A True Muslim must beat his disobedient wife: Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 4:34 “Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient and guard in (the husband’s) absence what Allah would have them guard, AS TO THOSE WOMEN ON WHOSE PART YOU FEAR DISLOYALTY AND ILL-CONDUCT: Admonish them (first), (Next), Do not share their beds (AND LAST) BEAT (TAP) THEM (LIGHTLY)…†Do you see the words in (…) they are not in the Arabic text. Here is Muslim Dr Muhammad Asad’s Commentary for this verse: The Meaning of the Glorious Quran Commentary 45 “When the above Quran-verse [Surah 4:34] AUTHORIZING THE BEATING OF A REFRACTORY WIFE WAS REVEALED, the Prophet is reported to have said: I wanted one thing but God has willed another thing and what God has willed must be best.â€
Sahih Bukhari Vol. 7, Hadith 715 page 479 “Narrated Ikrima: Rifaa divorced his wife whereupon Abdur-Rahman married her. Aisha said that the lady… complained to her and showed a GREEN SPOT ON HER SKIN CAUSED BY BEATING. It was the habit of ladies to support each other, so when Allah’s messenger came, Aisha said, I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY WOMAN SUFFERING AS MUCH AS THE BELIEVING WOMEN. Look! Her skin is greener than her clothes! When Abdur-Rahman heard that his wife had gone to the prophet, he came with his two sons from another wife. She said, By Allah! I have done no wrong to him, but he is impotent… Abdur-Rahman said… O Allah’s messenger! She has told a lie [that I am impotent]… BUT SHE IS DISOBEDIENT and wants to go back to Rifaa. Allah’s messenger said to her: If that is your intention [to go back to Rifaa], then know that it is unlawful for you to remarry Rifaa unless Abdur-Rahman has had sexual intercourse with you…†Notice that Muhammad never spoke out against this brutal beating [spots greener than her clothes].
Why? Because Muhammad also beat his wife - now before you call me a lier - here is your own authentic tradition — Sahih Muslim Vol. 2 Hadith 2127 page 461/2 “Aisha narrator … When it was my turn for Allah’s Messenger to spend the night with me, he turned his side, put on his mantle and took off his shoes and placed them near his feet, and spread the corner of his shawl on his bed and then lay down till he thought that I had gone to sleep. He took hold of his mantle slowly and put on the shoes slowly, and opened the door and went out and then closed it lightly. I went out following his steps till he reached Baqi’. He stood there and he stood for a long time. He then lifted his hands three times, and then returned and I also returned. He hastened his steps and I also hastened my steps. He ran and I too ran. He came (to the house) and I also came (to the house). I, however, preceded him and I entered (the house), and as I lay down in the bed, he (the Holy Prophet) entered the (house), and said: Why is it, O Aisha, that you are out of breath? I said: Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be ransom for you, and then I told him (the whole story). He said: Was it the darkness (of your shadow) that I saw in front of me? I said: Yes. HE STRUCK ME ON THE CHEST, WHICH CAUSED ME PAIN…â€
God Bless you
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 3rd, 2006 at 5:39 am
Hi Azim Quadir,
CORRUPTION: Bible vs. Quran?
Thank you for making YOUR RESPECTED view point clear of how you see the Holy Bible. At lease you have the privilege of freedom of speech to criticize what you think is wrong with the Bible, not like us who will be slaughtered in Mecca or Medina or any Muslim countries if we critic the Quran like you do the Bible.
Back to Quran 2:79 quoted above by yourself: When the Quran say: [[[…Woe to “THOSE” who write the “BOOK” with their own hands…]]] who is the “those” in this verse.
Lets read the full context this time and see what the Quran really says: Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 2:76-79 “Have you then no understanding? Know they not that Allah know WHAT THEY CONCEAL [NOT – WHAT THEY CORRUPTED] and what they reveal? And there are among them UNLETTERED PEOPLE, who KNOW NOT THE BOOK, but they trust upon false desires and THEY BUT GUESS. Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands and then say: This is from Allah, to purchase with it a little price! Woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for that they earn thereby.â€
In Ali’s Commentary 83 we read: “The immediate argument applies to the Jews of Medina…â€
OBSERVATIONS:
Please note the written text of the Bible is already about 600 years old at this stage. The context of the passage is speaking about people in Medina [600 A.D.] who CONCEALED the book. We simply ask honest Muslims to consult any English dictionary available to them to determine the meaning of “concealâ€. To save time, for now it means: “To hide or keep secret†and NOT altering NOR corrupting. Among the Jews are UNLETTERED PEOPLE. These people had no knowledge of the book/scriptures, but concocted scriptures of what they have GUESSED. The Quran condemns these locals who KNEW NOT THE BOOK, who wrote down what they GUESSED and said this is from God. Nowhere in its pages does the Quran state that the text of the Holy Bible was corrupted. I challenge you to present a Quranic verse in its context to proof this.
Question to the wise of this world: When were the Bible corrupted: Before Quran was seemingly revealed or after Quran was seemingly revealed?
While you are compiling your response - consider the following: If the Holy Bible was corrupted “after” the Quran came, then all we [Christians and Muslims] have to do is to compare biblical MSS dating before and after the Quran. Let me make a bold statement, I Michael Mahomed, BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN, reject all so-called Bible MSS dating after 632 A.D. that is in contradiction to Bible MSS dating before the Quran came.
So now you don’t have to bring evidence of corruption about so-called Bible MSS dating after 632 A.D. as I already rejects them.
This leaves you with one option. To build your case, the Bible could only be possibly corrupted before the Quran came. Lets assume the Holy Bible was corrupted before the Quran came.
Why than does the Quran instructs Muhammad and Muslims to follow the teachings of the Bible according to Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 6:83-90 “Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah, David, Solomon, Job, Joseph, Moses, Aaron, Zakariya, John, Jesus, Elias, Ismail, Elisha, Jonas, Lot… These were the men to whom we [Allah] gave the Book, Authority and prophethood… Those were the (prophets) who received God’s guidance: COPY THE GUIDANCE THEY RECEIVED…†Did Allah instruct Muslims to copy corruption? Awaiting your intelligent response.
The MSS of the Holy Bible got partly damaged. With this in mind, MSS were not complete when found. So, what happened, as more complete MSS were found, which dated back to biblical times, they were translated into modern day English. This then gave rise to some translations not being complete. For example: 1 John 5:7 that was found in earlier MSS but not later MSS, or to what you refer to contradictions concerning numbers, etc. Please note that we do not update our MSS to get rid of these defects.
Question, is it not strange to you that NO MSS is in conflict when it comes to doctrine?
Now lets turn the table on Muslims and see how consistent you will be. According to Muhammad, the Quran that was revealed to him had a verse in it that pertains to stoning the adulterer. Now before you call me kafir, here is the proof.
Sahih Bukhari Vol. 8 Hadith 817 page 539 “[Umar said:] Allah sent Muhammad with the Truth and revealed the holy book [The Quran] to him, AND AMONG WHAT ALLAH REVEALED [in the Holy Quran], was the verse of Rajam (the stoning of married persons (male and female) who commit adultery) and WE DID RECITE THIS VERSE AND UNDERSTOOD AND MEMORIZED IT. Allah’s Apostle did carry out the punishment of stoning and so did we after him. I am afraid that after a long time has passed, somebody will say: BY ALLAH, WE DO NOT FIND THE VERSE OF RAJAM IN ALLAH’S BOOK [THE QURAN], AND THUS THEY WILL GO ASTRAY BY LEAVING AN OBLIGATION WHICH ALLAH HAS REVEALED.†Please provide me with the original Quran that had this verse in it, do not present me a Quran without this verse. Based on Muslim standards used against the Bible, the Quran must than be perverted.
But wait I am not yet done: Which Quran do you follow, the one promoted on this Muslim site - http://www.submission.org/tampering.html - of which the last two verses of Surah 9 has been removed as false corruption or the Quran promoted by Abdul Yusuf Ali?
Lets assume that the missing verse of stoning the adulterer is a fabrication: then how will we trust any of the then so-called authentic traditions of Islam?
The mail is becoming long now, so I will just quote one contradiction from the Quran and see how you explain it away: Quran Translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 30:26 “To Him [Allah] belongs every being that is in the heavens and on earth: all are devoutly obedient to Him.” This verse says every being on earth is devoutly obedient to Allah: Question - Is the rapist obedient to Allah? Is the homosexual obedient to Allah? Is the atheist obedient to Allah?
Dare me, and I will quote for you passages from the Quran and authentic traditions where Muslims are allowed to go to war and if they win the war, they may rape the victims even in the presence of their living husbands.
Lastly, did you know Muslims will enjoy wine in heaven? Then why forbid it on earth? I would like to see your responses here… obviously followed up with my counter responses to point out your flaws [or may mine]…
Come unto me and I will give you rest… Do you know who said these words?
God Bless
Yours in Christ
Bro. Michael Mahomed
November 3rd, 2006 at 6:40 am
Hi Zik
ARGUE IN BEAUTIFUL WAYS OR KILL WITH THE SWORD
You are right, Muhammad preached Quran Surah 16:125 “Invite (all) to the Way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious: for thy Lord knoweth best, who have strayed from His Path, and who receive guidance.” This you very well know is a Meccan verse.
Oh! Let me first explain to our readers what I mean. The Holy Bible is divided into two parts: New and Old Testament. The Quran is not literally divided into two parts. However, Muhammad started his peaceful ministry in Mecca where both him and his followers were persecuted by pagan Arabs. Muhammad could not protect his followers and allowed them to run. Good advice from their leader. Later on Muhammad’s own protectors died and Muhammad was now in danger and left Mecca to go to Medina. Here Muhammad’s military power grew by the day.
So all I am trying to say is that we must look at the Quran in its possible chronological order of so-called revealed verses to understand its impact.
Now Muhammad found himself in Medina as a Military leader and the scores changed. He now no more preached peace - now it is the sword.
The Noble Quran Surah 8:38-39, 65 “Say to those who have disbelieved, if they cease (from disbelieve) there past will be forgiven. But if they return (thereto) then the examples of those (punished) before them have already preceded (as a warning). AND FIGHT THEM [THE DISBELIEVERS] UNTIL: THERE IS NO MORE “FITNAH†(DISBELIEVE AND POLYTHEISM, I.E. WORSHIPPING OTHERS BESIDES GOD) AND THE RELIGION [DIIN] (WORSHIP) WILL BE ALL FOR ALLAH ALONE (IN THE WHOLE OF THE WORLD). BUT IF THEY CEASE (WORSHIPPING OTHERS BESIDES ALLAH) then certainly Allah is All-Seer of what they do.†Please note who must be fought - it clearly says the disbelievers.
The Noble Quran Surah 4:89 “They wish that you REJECT FAITH, AS THEY HAVE REJECTED (FAITH) and thus that you all become equal. So take not Auliya (protectors or friends) from them, till they emigrate in the way of Allah. BUT IF THEY TURN BACK (FROM ISLAM) TAKE (HOLD OF THEM) AND KILL THEM WHEREVER YOU FIND THEMâ€
Ali’s translation Surah 9:3, 5 “…And proclaim a GRIEVOUS PENALTY TO THOSE WHO REJECT FAITH… SLAY THE IDOLATERS wherever you find them… IF THEY REPENT AND TAKE TO PRAYER and pay the alms-tax let them go their way…†A penalty against who? Those who reject faith, i.e. Islam. Slay who? Slay the idolaters.
The Noble Quran Surah 9:29 “FIGHT AGAINST THOSE WHO BELIEVE NOT: In Allah, Nor in the Last Day, Nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, And those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission and feel themselves subdued.†Who must be fought? Those who believe not… Look at the last part of this verse - they must even fight Christians and Jews — where is Muhammad’s advice of beautiful preaching now.
See what the Muslims in South Africa is saying: Abdurraghiem Hasan Sallie: The Decree of the Murtad (Apostate) According to the Islamic law†pages 3,7,23,24,25,26 & 30 [Available from: A. Sallie, 2 Nerina Street, Parow North, 7500 Cape Town] “Apostasy is the act of abandoning one’s religion for another [turning back from Islam]… The Arabic word for apostasy is riddah… Ibn Kathir, volume 4 pp. 296-299: “The learned jurists, Imams. Malikiy, Shafi-iy and Hambaliy agree that APOSTASY CARRIED THE DEATH PENALTY IRRESPECTIVE OF GENDER… The Holy Prophet (PBUH) had said: WHOEVER CHANGES HIS [ISLAMIC] RELIGION, THEN KILL HIM… HE MUST BE BEHEADED… The punishment in a Muslim country for apostacy is the death penalty. Before execution the apostate is incarcerated but granted respite for three days. He must be fed daily with a spare diet of one loaf of bread. During the respite, knowledgeable scholars – Ulama, to try and convince and encourage him to repent and to revert to Islam, must visit him. If, he fails the APOSTATE IS EXECUTED… THE ABOVE ACCOUNT CONTAINS USEFUL GUIDANCE FOR MUSLIMS IN THE REPUBLIC OF SOUTH AFRICA. While Islamic law cannot be implemented in this country, Muslims can however, register their disgust by EXCOMMUNICATING APOSTATES FROM THE MUSLIM SOCIETY… THOSE WHO VOLUNTARY ASSOCIATE WITH APOSTATES ARE TRAITORS AND HYPOCRITES, (A DANGER TO ISLAM).â€
So where is the beautiful preaching now?
Unfortunately for you Zik, Muslims do see the truth and they repent. Now past Sunday I preached at a baptismal service where a Muslim, praise God, was baptised.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 4:22 am
Hi Sweetness.
DOES ALLAH FORGIVE SINS?
It is with great regret that I learn about your conversion from Roman Catholism to Islam. You should have tried Biblical Christianity. Please note that the Bible does not instruct any Christian to kill you for leaving so-called Christianity. But please do me a favor, do not go live in a Muslim country only to later reconvert BACK to Christianity, you will have the True Muslims ready to kill you according to The Noble Quran Surah 4:89 “They wish that you REJECT FAITH, AS THEY HAVE REJECTED (FAITH) and thus that you all become equal. So take not Auliya (protectors or friends) from them, till they emigrate in the way of Allah. BUT IF THEY TURN BACK (FROM ISLAM) TAKE (HOLD OF THEM) AND KILL THEM WHEREVER YOU FIND THEM†The Noble Quran Commentary 2 page 151/ Also see page 808 “Narrated Abdullah Allah’s Messenger said: THE BLOOD OF A MUSLIM who confesses that… (None has the right to be worshipped but Allah) and that I am the messenger of Allah, CANNOT BE SHED EXCEPT… THE ONE WHO REVERTS FROM ISLAM (APOSTATES) AND LEAVES THE MUSLIMS†Sahih al-Bukhari Volume 9 Hadith 58 page 46: “Muadh Ibn Jabal went to visit Abu Musa the governor of Yemen. He offered him a cushion to sit on. A man tied on with robes was there. Muadh asked Abu Musa: What is this? He answered! This man was a Jew and then he was converted to Islam, later HE APOSTATIZED AND TURNED A JEW AGAIN. MUAHD SAID TO HIM: I WILL NEVER EVEN SIT DOWN ON A CUSHION UNTIL THIS MAN IS PUT TO DEATH. (THIS IS) THE VERDICT OF GOD AND HIS APOSTLE. (THE GOVERNOR) ORDERED HIM TO BE KILLED. (Only after that) Abu Muadh sat.â€
Okay, let me get back to the subject line: Does Allah forgive sins? The Quran does repeatedly states that Allah is the Most forgiving. But where in the Quran does he actually say to a sinner/prophet that I forgive you?
Did you know
[a] Not even Abraham our father of many nations [Bible Genesis 17:5, Romans 4:17 Quran 2:124] had the assurance that his sins were/are forgiven. According to Quran he will hope for his sins to be forgiven ON THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT: Quran Translation by Abdul Y. Ali Surah 26:82 “And Who, I [Abraham] hope, will forgive me my faults on the Day of Judgment.â€
[b] Even Muhammad was not sure what will happen to him on that day Quran AYA Surah 46:9 “Say: I am no bringer of new-fangled doctrine among the apostles, NOR DO I KNOW WHAT WILL BE DONE WITH ME or with you…â€
[c] Quran Translation by Muslim Dr Rashad Khalifah Surah 21:28 “They do not intercede except for those already accepted by him, and THEY [THE PROPHETS] ARE WORRIED ABOUT THEIR OWN NECKS.â€
How can you say that Allah forgives sins if he did not even forgive these people sin who are giants in Islam, are you greater then them?
According to the Quran, you will be permitted to heaven if your good deeds out weight your bad deeds. For example: Quran Translation by Ali Surah 7:8-9 “The balance that day will be true (to nicety): those whose scale (of good) will be heavy, will prosper: Those whose scale will be light, will be their souls in perdition, for that they wrongfully treated Our signs.” Question to you, if I raped one Muslim virgin girl who all her life tries to please Allah perfectly - what good deeds must I perform to out weight my bad deeds - please assist me as it will help me to give prisons comfort when I do prison missionary work. If I commit adultery, must I be stoned to death or what good deeds can I do to out weight my bad deeds?
If Adam disobeyed his Lord once [Quran 20:121], ate of the fruit of the tree and was kicked out of paradise, how will we make paradise if we disobey him every day, lets face it, there is no forgiveness in Islam.
Also, maybe, there is forgiveness when we commit adultery because Allah wills it for us to do this evil, now before you call me kafir, in the name of your Lord read - you say but I am unlettered - I say - in the name of your Lord read: Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 8 Hadith Number 609 page 397-398 “… The Prophet said: “ALLAH HAS WRITTEN FOR THE SON OF ADAM HIS INEVITABLE SHARE OF ADULTERY whether he is aware of it or not…†Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421, see also Number 6422 “Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Apostle as saying: VERILY ALLAH HAS FIXED THE VERY PORTION OF ADULTERY WHICH A MAN WILL INDULGE IN AND WHICH HE OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT…”
Muslims say that Christians want an easy ride on the cross - No! Jesus died, that was the atonement. But in Islam, whether Muslims are aware of it or not, your good deeds means nothing in the sight of Allah/ God. In fact, the Bible say Titus “Not by works of righteouness which we have done but by his mercy he saved us…” and oh! Yes! Islam agrees: Quran translation by Ali Surah 24:21 “O ye who believe! follow not Satan’s footsteps: if any will follow the footsteps of Satan, he will (but) command what is shameful and wrong: AND WERE IT NOT FOR THE GRACE AND MERCY OF GOD ON YOU, not one of you would ever have been pure: but God doth purify whom He pleases: and God is One Who hears and knows (all things).” Yes! Muhammad agrees: Sahih Bukhari Vol. 8 Hadith 474 page 315 “Narrated Aishah, the prophet said: Do good deeds properly, sincerely and moderately and receive good news BECAUSE ONE’S GOOD DEEDS WILL NOT MAKE HIM ENTER PARADISE. They asked: Even you O Allah’s messenger? He said: Even I, unless or until ALLAH PROTECTS OR COVERS ME WITH HIS PARDON AND MERCY†Also see The Noble Quran Commentary 1 page 28
Lets be realistic, an Allah that wills you to commit adultery is not the Christian Allah.
How do you know right now that your sins are forgiven? While search the Quran for possible answers [which there is none unless it contradicts the hopes of prophets] here is the Bible assurance that I have: New Testament Romans 8:1 “There is therefore now NO CONDEMNATION to them which are in Christ Jesus…â€
Hope you realise your mistake, repent, and turn back to Christ your Saviour.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 6:41 am
Hi Marlon
MUHAMMAD ILLITERATE?????
For years we accepted that Muhammad was illiterate, well the days of ignorance are gone by. Quran translation by Dr Rashad Khalifah Surah 17:36 reads: “You shall not accept any information UNTIL YOU verify it for YOURSELF…â€
Here is why I believe Muhammad was very intelligent.
Quran translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali - Surah 7:157 “Allaziina yattabi-uunar-Rasuulan-Nabiyyal-UMMIY-yallazii… Those who follow the messenger, the UNLETTERED prophet…†But wait, all Muslims do not agree with Ali’s translation, lets consider Dr Rashad Khalifah’s Version: “Follow the messenger, the GENTILE prophet…†According to other Translators, although their versions seem to promote the idea that Muhammad was illiterate, they do agree on the alternative meaning of “Gentilesâ€.
N.J. Dawood’s Commentary 2 pages 121 “The word can also mean Gentile.†Muhammad Pickthall admits: Commentary 1 page 133 Also “Gentile.â€
T. P. Huges confirms: Dictionary of Islam page 138 “Gentiles – Arabic “Ummiâ€
From the above, it is obvious that not all Muslim Translators agree on the exact interpretation of “ummiâ€. It is clear that this Arabic word have a dual meaning. If we consult other verses in the Quran, it becomes clear that this word must not be interpreted as illiterate as it’s context may very well result in historical contradictions.
The below verses will definitely underline this analysis.
Ali Surah 3:20 “Say to the People of the Book and to those who are unlearned…†Herewith we present Dr Muhammad Asad’s note on this verse: The Glorious Meaning of the Quran, Commentary 14 page 69 “According to Razi, this “UMMY†refers to PEOPLE WHO HAVE NO REVEALED SCRIPTURES OF THEIR OWN.†unquote: in others words “gentiles”
Muslim Scholar Edip Yuksel wrote: “19 Questions for Muslim Scholars. Page 41/4 Under the heading: The Quran explains the true meaning of “ummy†“Anyone can easily understand that “ummy†DOES NOT MEAN AN ILLITERATE PERSON BY REFLECTING ON THE VERSE 3:20 below: And say to those who received the scripture, as well as those who did not receive any scripture (ummyyeen)… (b) The Quran describes Meccan people with the word “ummyyeen = gentiles (62:2). According to your claim, all Meccan people must have been illiterate. Who was writing poems in Mecca… Who was reading the poems hanging on the walls of the Kaba? You are trying to imitate Muhammad from his eating to his attire, from his beard to his toothbrush, why do you not imitate his illiteracy [if he was illiterate]? Why do you not follow his Sunnah?â€
Ali Surah 62:2 “…It is He who has sent amongst the UNLETTERED a messenger from among themselves…†Although Y. Ali chooses to use the word “UNLETTERED†in his translation, he was forced to admit that: AYA Commentary 5451 “The UNLETTERED AS APPLIED TO A PEOPLE, the Arabs.†unquote: If the correct translation is “unlettered” then it means that all who say the Meccans/ Arabs were good poets are liars - how can poets be illiterate.
I.A Ibrahim wrote: A Brief Illustrated Guide to Understanding Islam page 33 “The Arabs at the time of Muhammad were a very eloquent people who used to compose beautiful and EXCELLENT poetry, still read and appreciated today.â€
It is then clear that “unlettered†does not fit the interpretation of illiteracy. Therefore, when the Quran described the Arabs as ummi it does not mean illiterate [could neither read nor write] we are forced to believe it meant gentiles.
According to the Quran, it is clear that Muhammad’s contemporaries acknowledged Muhammad as a literate person. The Noble Quran Surah 25:5 “And they say: Tales of the ancients, which HE HAS WRITTEN DOWN…†Dr Rashad Khalifah Quran Version of this verse: “They also said: Tales from the past that HE WROTE DOWN, THEY WERE DICTATED TO HIM DAY AND NIGHT…†In his Appendix 28 page 474 “…You cannot dictate to an illiterate person…”
Please read Quran 2:78-79 again: In verse 78 a party id described to be from the Jews who are ummi - but in verse 79 we are told they wrote what they guessed with their hands. How can illiterate people write so well.
The below Islamic sources leaves us no doubt that Muhammad was in fact intelligent. I.A Ibrahim continues: A Brief Illustrated Guide to Understanding Islam page 37 “Before his mission as a prophet, Muhammad had no financial worries. As a successful and reputed merchant, Muhammad drew a satisfactory and comfortable income.â€
Dr Rashad Khalifah’s Quran Version Appendix 28 page 474 “…The prophet was a successful merchant. The Muslim scholars who fabricated the illiteracy lie forgot that there were no numbers during the prophet’s time; the letters of the alphabet were used as numbers. AS A MERCHANT DEALING WITH NUMBERS EVERY DAY, THE PROPHET HAD TO KNOW THE ALPHABET…â€
In Ali’s Quran Version: Introduction C. 23 page 7 “But he grew steadfastly in virtue and purity: Untaught by men, HE LEARNT FROM MEN AND LEARNED TO TEACH THEM, even as a boy of nine when he went in a trade caravan with Abu Talib to Syria…â€
Muslim writer, Dr. Haykal “The life of Muhammad†page 50 wrote: “Until the fifth year of his life, Muhammad remained with the tribe of Banu Sa’d inhaling with the pure air of the desert the spirit of personal freedom and independence. From this tribe HE LEARNED THE ARABIC LANGUAGE IN ITS PUREST AND MOST CLASSICAL FORM… The uprightness, INTELLIGENCE, charity and good disposition of Muhammad strengthened the uncle’s attachment to him… Despite his GREAT INTELLIGENCE and outstanding ability, he [Muhammad] listened well and attentively to anyone who spoke to him…â€
Its quite clear that informed Muslims doesn’t look at Muhammad as an illiterate Arab, neither should we.
God bless Bro Marlon
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 7:06 am
Hi Tom.
You wrote: “It seems unfair for God to suddenly kill his “son†…”
Please note that God did not “suddenly” kill his own son. This was his plan all the time. If it is unfair, than both Allah and God is unfair as the Bible and the Quran teaches that it was Allah’s/God’s plan to kill him.
It has been prophecied in the Holy Bible almost hundreds of centuries before it happened. This is so wonderful because the Old Testament MSS dates before Christianity, meaning that Christians did not exist when these prophecies were made. So, Muslims can’t accuse us of fabricating scriptures with our own hands. Here is a few examples Old Testament - DANIEL 9:21-26 “Whiles I was still praying… Gabriel informed me … I am now come to give thee understanding… Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people … to make reconciliation for iniquity… And after threescore and two weeks SHALL MESSIAH BE CUT OFF…†Old Testament - ISAIAH 53:1-12 “…He is despised and rejected of men… He was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities, the chastisement of our peace was upon him, and with his stripes we are healed… The Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all… FOR HE WAS CUT OFF OUT OF THE LAND OF THE LIVING… His soul an offering for sin… For he shall bear their iniquities…â€
Quran translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 3:55 “Behold! God said: O Jesus! I will “muTAWAFfeeka†[take thee] and raise thee to myself…†Ali decided to use an English idiom “I will take thee.†Please note that Ali is aware that the accurate root meaning of the Arabic word means “to die†- Surah 6:61 “…At length, when “TAWAF†death approaches one of you…â€
Quran translation as it appears in the Dictionary of Islam page 233 “…Surah 3:55 O Jesus! I will cause thee to die…â€
Quran translation by Sale “When God said, O Jesus, verily I will cause thee to die, and I will take thee up unto me…â€
Maulana Muhammad Ali’s Quran Translation “…O Jesus! I will cause thee to die and exalt thee in my presence…†Maulana Muhammad Ali’s Quran - Commentary 436 Page 147: “According to LL, it signifies: God took his soul or caused him to die. NO OTHER SIGNIFICANCE CAN BE ATTACHED TO THE WORDS WHEN THUS USED… Some Commentators say that Jesus remained dead for 3 hours…â€
Muslim writer, Faruq Sheriff confirms: A guide to the contents of the Quran - Page 94 “God says: O Jesus, I will cause you to die and will take you up to myself CLEARLY MAKES HIS ASCENSION FOLLOW DEATH.â€
Please note that in this verse Surah 3:55 Allah caused the death of Jesus. So Allah is responsible for the death of Jesus Christ but it so appeared that the Jews were responsible since they were the physical instigators that forced Pilate to crucify and kill Jesus.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 7:53 am
Hi James Ngyn.
DOES ALLAH PRAY - IF YES - TO WHOM DOES HE PRAY?
The Bible teaches that there is One God. It never uses the term Trinity. So, I will stick to the biblical term of One God. I refuse to use the term that was originated by a Catholic: New International Encyclopedia Vol. 22 page 477 “The term “Trinity†was originated by a Roman Catholic Father, Tertullian.â€
There is only One God. Almighty Jehovah Spirit was manifested in flesh and was call the Son of God. The Father is the Spirit and Jesus was the body that he dwelt in. The body of Jesus came into existence about 2000 years ago not his Spirit. Just like me, I came into existenc almost 37 years ago, should I die today, my body will cease to exist but my Spirit will live on. I am body, soul and Spirit - yet I am one person not two, three… My spirit can do what my body can’t and vice versa, yet I am one Person all the time, unless you want to convince me that I am three people because I am body, soul and spirit.
Jesus as a man did pray but as God he created the world in his Spirit form.
Now, we have been giving these explanations for centuries and stubborn Muslims rejects it. Let me turn the table on you for a while:
Does God pray, if yes, to whom? Quran translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 6:51 & 70, 32:4 “…EXCEPT FOR HIM [ALLAH] THEY WILL HAVE NO … INTERCESSOR… But proclaim (to them) this (truth): That every soul delivers itself to ruin by its own acts, it will find for itself NO … INTERCESSOR EXCEPT GOD…ye have NONE, BESIDES HIM, TO … INTERCEDE (for you)…â€
Muhammad in the above Quran message say that Allah is the only intercessor - yet he contradicted his own message according to authentic Islam traditions where he states that others can also intercede - Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 93, Number 532s “… The Prophet added: Then the prophets and Angels and the believers will intercede AND (LAST OF ALL) THE ALMIGHTY (ALLAH) WILL SAY: NOW REMAINS MY INTERCESSION…†Actually, I wanted to show here that even Muhammad believed that Allah is an interceder. Question for James: Do you know what the meaning of “intercession” is? It means one party is pleading on behalf of another party to someone else for mercy. Now id Allah is interceding, to whom is Allah pleading with to show mercy?
The Quran clearly states that Allah also pray: Surah 33:56 [Also see Surah 33:43] Translation by Palmer: Verily God and His angels pray for the Prophet.O ye who believe! Pray for him and salute him with a salutation.
Muslims, like Abdul Yusuf Ali was obviously embarrased and mistranslated the Arabic word “salat” into blessings instead of “pray” The Arabic word for “blessings” is “Baraku”
Compare for example Surah 6:92 “And this is a [kitab - Book] which We have [anzal - sent] down, bringing [BARAKU - blessings] and they are constant in guarding their [SALAT - prayers].†This verse is clear undeniable proof that the words “salla - pray†and “barak - blessing†are as different in Arabic as it is in English. They do not even share the same root words in the Arabic language.
Drs Hilali & Khan decided to leave the word untranslated in Surah 33:56 and added interpolations (…) to their English Version:
NQ “Allah sends His salat (Graces, honour, blessings, mercy) on the Prophet (Muhammad) and also his angels (ask Allah to bless and forgive him). O you who believe! Send your salat on (ask Allah to bless) him…†Once again, the Arabic word for “send†is not in the verse. These Muslim doctors dare not even indicate in their interpolations that the meaning could include “prayerâ€. That the Arabic word “salat†means “to invoke or request†is clearly demonstrated in their interpolations. Thank God this is not the Bible or Muslims would have condemned it like crazy. There are specific Arabic words for those in the interpolation brackets and they definitely do not appear in this verse: “Surah 1:7 grace – anaamta, Surah 2:37 mercy – rahmatuh, Surah 17:70 honour - karramna.â€
Dr Rashad Khalifah documented the meaning of the Arabic word “salat†in his book: Quran, Hadith and Islam page 44 “THE WORD “SALAT†IS VERY SPECIFIC AND MEANS ONLY ONE THING, I.E. THE OBSERVANCE OF SPECIFIC PRACTICES INVOLVING BOWING AND PROSTRATION. THIS IS TRUE THROUGHOUT QURAN…†Although, Dr. Khalifah knows the true meaning of the Arabic word “salat†throughout the Quranic text, which involve “bowing and prostration†as quoted above, he was enticed to deliberately distort the true English understanding of the Quranic message in his illustrious Authorized English Version of the Quran: This is how he now deceided to translate this verse Surah 33:56 “GOD and His angels help and support the prophet. O you who believe, you shall help and support him, and regard him as he should be regarded.†Dr. Khalifah is well aware that the Arabic word for “helpâ€, which is “ansuroo†is not in this verse. Dr. Khalifah totally abandoned his understanding of the Arabic word as explained in his book and of course, we sympathies with him since all Muslims are confronted with the same difficulty and opted to rather present the non-Arabic reader with deliberate mistranslations.
To whom did Allah pray too?
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 10:49 pm
Dear Kari
SINNERS vs. SAINTS
Over-all I’m impress with your arguments. But, listen, my dear, where in the Bible does God, or the prophets or apostles address us as sinners after we accepted the Lord Jesus Christ as our Saviour. We are saints. You see the Catholic Church calls dead people saints. No, we are saints when we are bloodwashed. Read the NT - where does it say unto the sinners, it clearly says unto the saints [Romans 1:7] unto the church of God, the santified [1 Cor. 1:2, Gal. 1:2], etc…
Yes, we make mistakes and if we do, we have a heavenly high priest interceding for us [Heb. 8]
I would like to agree with you that pushing Jesus off could result in the blesphemious sin, but I never saw a scripture yet that teaches that. Please note, I said, I never saw a scripture, I don’t say there is none. But here is what I saw.
Matthew 12:32 [Also see Luke 12:10] And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
We are not sinners, we are born-again, bloodwashed, Holy Ghost filled, Redeemed Children of God, the Bride of Jesus Christ, a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God.
No we are not sinners, we were sinners, but God gave us grace.
Finally, we are not sinners but we are Christ-like, we are Christians. Forget those things which are in the past and reach out to the high calling in Christ Jesus. A sinner sins but a Saint reflects Christ, so much so that the world will call us Christ-like, they will call us Christians.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 6th, 2006 at 11:24 pm
Hi Azim Quadir
DON’T BE FOOLED BY LANGUAGES.
It is true that Jesus never heard the English name “Jesus” in his earthly humane life time! That is an honest statement from a Jesus-loving Christian.
Now lets see how honest you can be as a Quran-honoring Muslim. The son of Mary never heard the Arabic name ISA in his earthly humane life time! Wrong or right? The Quran describes the supposingly revealed words spoken by Christ in Arabic.
Christ or Messiah or Son of Mary did not speak Arabic whilest being on earth, I challenge you to present me the words of the Son of Mary in his original language not in English not in Arabic? Lets see how far you will get. You must learn to be consistent, until then you will always find fault.
The question is not what language did Jesus speak - the question is: Do we have the true understanding of the message given then.
The Quran is in Arabic but most of my Muslim friends does not even understand Arabic. Oh! yes!!!! they are excellent Arabic speakers when it comes to greeting and responding in greeting. But give them an Arabic verse from the Quran, they can’t even tell what it means. So how does it benefit you to have the Quran only in Arabic? How will it benefit me to only have the Bible in Hebrew and Greek? The Quran or Bible becomes a powerful book for its followers when they understand the message.
Lastly, you argument of the King James Version is corrupted because who will argue with a King. Listen my friend [I can call you friend but you can’t call me friend - Quran 5:50-55] The Biblical MSS is older than the King James Version [I prefer to say Translation because that’s what it is] So, if you doubt the King James Version, buy some Hebrew/ Greek MSS bibles and get yourself some scholars you can trust and let them translate it for you. Believe me, you will get the message/understanding that’s found in the KJV.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 7th, 2006 at 5:34 am
Hi Azim Quadir.
You wrote: “Stephanie: You practice Christianity and you are a devout christen and I respect your faith.”
How can you say you respect our faith. You are suppose to curse us. Quran translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Surah 9:30 “…The Christians call Christ the son of God. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. God’s curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!”
Please explain to me how you can respect something ALLAH/Muhammad curses? You do not really respect our faith.
Here is what you should say: “Stephanie: You practice Christianity and you are a devout christen and I disagree with your faith and I curse you.”
While the Quran teaches you to curse, the Bible teaches me to love my enemies, pray for them that misuse me, etc… Open your eyes and see that Islam is not peaceful, it curses and kill those who disagree with it.
God Bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 7th, 2006 at 5:51 am
Hi Stephanie
You wrote: “My studies have shown me that Islam came from the descendants of Ishmael…”
I do not claim to be the expert on Islam, but I do claim to have researched Islam. As you can see, everything I say I back it back.
With due respect to you my Christ-loving sister, please provide me with some evidence that Islam came from the descendants of Ishmael.
According to me, it does not, here is my evidence: Quran translation by Abdul Yusuf Ali Commentary 906 p. 312 & Commentary 4101 p. 1205 “(Ismail son of Abraham) he became the founder of the new Arab nation… Ismail, ancestor of the Arabs…â€
Since the above are only commentaries by a devoted Muslim and not divine revelation according to Islam, we will again push the Quran one side because of it being silence and turn to the Bible: [Gen. 13:18] Abram the Hebrew [not an Arab] lived in the plains of Mamre in Hebron, which is in the Land of Canaan [Gen. 16:3] NOT ARABIA. Abram the Hebrew went into Sarai’s handmaid [had sexual intercourse with] Hagar the Egyptian [Gen. 16:1-2] and she bare him Ishmael. [Gen. 16:16] Abram was 86 yrs old when Ishmael, his eldest son, was born. Ishmael lived with Abram for more than 15 yrs as a Hebrew descendant born in Canaan. From 86 yrs to 100 yrs when Isaac was born according to Gen 17:17 & 21:5 = 14 yrs + at lease two years until Isaac’s weaning time according to Gen. 21:8-10. This means that Ishmael grew up as a Hebrew in Canaan [not Arabia, not Medina nor Mecca].
I AM 100% CONVINCED THAT HEBREW + EGYPTIAN ≠AN ARAB, right?
In Gen. 21:10 Ishmael and his mother were cast out from the house of Abram. They immigrated towards the south to the Wilderness of Paran [Gen. 21:21] and Hagar took for Ishmael a wife from Egypt according to the Bible.
WAS ISHMAEL THE PROGENITOR OF THE ARAB NATION?
Muslim scriptures and history actually confirms that ISHMAEL WAS NOT AN ARAB NOR THE PROGENITOR OF THE ARABS.
Surah 36:06 “In order that thou [Muhammad] mayest admonish a PEOPLE [ARABS], WHOSE FATHERS HAD RECEIVED NO ADMONITION, and who therefore remain heedless…â€
But the same Quran tells us that Surah 6:84-89, 19:54 “…And ISHMAEL… These were the men to whom we GAVE THE BOOK… PROPHETHOODâ€
NB: How could Ishmael, who according to the Quran received a book and was a prophet, be Muhammad’s ancestor, if Muhammad’s ancestors received no admonition, no book and no prophet?
According to Sahih Al-Bukhari Vol 4 Hadith 583 page 375 “She [Hagar] lived in that way TILL SOME PEOPLE FROM THE TRIBE OF JURHUM OR A FAMILY FROM JURHUM PASSED BY HER AND HER CHILD… The child (i.e. Ishmael) grew up AND LEARNT ARABIC FROM THEM… and when he reached the age of puberty they made him marry A WOMAN FROM AMONGST THEM [i.e. the Jurhum people]…â€
According to Imam Bukhari, Ishmael [about 20 years old] learnt Arabic from pilgrims. Since the Arabic language existed before Ishmael was born, it undeniably indicates that Arab ancestors existed long before Ishmael was even born. Therefore, Ishmael cannot be the fountain head of the Arab Nation. Ishmael’s mother tongue was Hebrew and/ or Egyptian, not Arabic. Bukhari is also clear on this point.
Muslim apologist, W. Aliyyuddin Shareef, on pages 3-4 of his booklet: “In response to Robert Morey’s Islamic Invasion†is honest enough to admit: “In pre-Islamic times ISHMAEL WAS NEVER MENTIONED AS THE FATHER OF THE ARABS.â€
We already mentioned above that Abram was a Hebrew. It is therefore obvious that his offspring will be Hebrews. This is exactly how the Bible describes the lineage of Isaac and Jacob in Exodus 2: 11 [3:18, 4:29, 5:3] “…When Moses was grown… He spied an Egyptian smiting AN HEBREW, ONE OF HIS BRETHREN.â€
IN CONCLUSION – THERE ARE NO EVIDENCE IN THE QURAN AS REFERENCE THAT ABRAHAM AND ISHMAEL ARE THE ANCESTORS OF MUHAMMAD.
We challenge Muslims to provide only one verse from the Quran that Ishmael was the ancestor of Muhammad or the progenitor of the Arab Nation.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 7th, 2006 at 11:00 pm
Hi Kari
You wrote: “So good deeds dont count huh? Ive met jewish, muslim, sihk, atheist, and hindu physicians.. the most nicest and trustworthy people ive ever worked with (im a male nurse)… you mean to tell me they’re going to hell? I could understand an atheist going to hell… but not the God fearing ones?”
Tell me, what is the criteria to make it for heaven? Do you agree that “no man can come to the Father except through Jesus Christ? If yes, tell me, how is the nice Muslim Dr, etc. going to make it? Remember that the Pharisee was also nice, he prayed, he did nice things, but the tax collector acknowledge he was a sinner, who made it? The nice pharisee or the tax collector? You must acknowledge you are a sinner, then believe in Jesus sacrifice, then you are bloodwashed - then you qualify for heaven - if a nice muslim is willing to acknowledge his sins, confess Jesus with his mouth and believe in heart that he rose, then the nice muslim, atheist, hindu will make it for heaven. But hey, the minute he does those things then he is no more a nice muslim, etc. He is a Christian.
Don’t try to be nice - in other words - don’t try to manufactor wool - just become a lamb and the wool grows automatically.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 8th, 2006 at 6:44 am
Hi Azim Quadir.
ISHMAIL OR ISAAC, WHO WAS THE ONLY SON?
Whether you study the Bible or Quran, on face-value, anything can appear to be contradictory.
For example: A certain man said to his first audience, this is my son. This same man said to another class of audience, pointing to the very same boy, this is not my son. Question: Did the man contradict himself when he addresed his two audiences? At face-value, a BIG YESSSSSSSSSS!!! But when you look deeper into the case and analysis it objectively, this outcome changes. Legally, the boy was an adopted son but he was not a biological son.
It is always wise to consider all the info before we make a hasty decision. For example: Nowhere does the Bible and especially in Genesis 22:2 say that Isaac was the only EXISTING son.
Please see my introduction in my posting dated November 2nd, 2006 at 3:23am above and addressed to Stephanie. I copied and paste it here for easy reference: “…I do not understand Arabic, so I collect every English translation of the Quran I can get to see how Muslims understand/ interpret the meaning of their holy book…” The same counts for the Holy Bible, I do not understand the Hebrew/ Greek languages, so I also collect different translations to get better understanding.
Below are a few translations of Genesis 22:2. You will immediately see that it does not say Isaac was the only EXISTING son, but it does say he was the only son LOVED by Abraham.
New American Standard Bible (NASB): He said, “Take now your son, YOUR ONLY SON WHOM YOU LOVE, Isaac and go to the land of Moriah…
King James Version (KJV): And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac WHOM THOU LOVEST, and get thee into the land of Moriah…
New International Version (NIV): Then God said, “Take your son, your only son Isaac WHOM YOU LOVE, and go to the region of Moriah…
The Message (MSG): He said, “Take your dear son Isaac WHOM YOU LOVE and go to the land of Moriah…
American Standard Version (ASV): And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son WHOM THOU LOVEST, even Isaac, and get thee into the land of Moriah…”
So, there you have it, Isaac was not the only existing son, but he was the only loved son.
Let me help you to digest the above by turning the tables on you:
Quran Surah 11:42-46 “So the Ark floated with them on the waves (towering) like mountains, and NOAH CALLED OUT TO HIS SON, who had separated himself (from the rest): “O my son! embark with us, and be not with the unbelievers! The son replied: “I will betake myself to some mountain: it will save me from the water.” Noah said: “This day nothing can save, from the command of God, any but those on whom He hath mercy! “And the waves came between them, and the son was among those overwhelmed in the Flood. And Noah called upon his Lord, and said: “O my Lord! SURELY MY SON IS OF MY FAMILY! and Thy promise is true, and Thou art the justest of Judges! HE [ALLAH] SAID: O NOAH! HE IS NOT OF THY FAMILY: FOR HIS CONDUCT IS UNRIGHTEOUS. So ask not of Me that of which thou hast no knowledge! I give thee counsel, lest thou act like the ignorant!”
In these verses we learn that Noah’s biological son did not make the save journey because of his ill-conduct. Allah disregarded Noah’s son as a righteous follower of Noah because of his unrighteousness and not because he was not Noah’s biological son.
But it does not end there! The Quran here teaches that Noah’s biological son drowned and than it contradicts itself by stating that Noah’s biological offspring [seed-progeny] will not drown Quran Surah 37:77 “And made his progeny to endure (on this earth)”
So while Surah 11 [biological son vs. rightuoes son] does not contradict itself, it does contradict Surah 37:33 [biological sons] will endure on earth.
God bless
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
November 12th, 2006 at 12:48 pm
Here is the family tree of Muhammad….http://www.answering-christianity.com/muhammad_family_tree.htm. The Quran states that Abraham took Ishmael instead of Isaac to be sacrificed to God, even though no such sacrifice took place. The Bible states it was Isaac who was to be sacrificed. So, there is obvious inconsistancy between the two books. Even though the Quran does not state that Muhammad came from the line of Ishmael, I have found many Muslim commentaries that state he is. Even though you may think that a Hebrew+Egyptian do not make an Arab, it is quite possible that they can. During those times, people traveled all over the world from Israel and Egypt. They became the founders of many Middle Eastern countries. All the nations of the world come from Adam and Eve, so it is possible for Muhammad to come from Ishmael.
November 13th, 2006 at 5:02 am
Hi Stephanie,
Thank you very much for your reply.
I am well aware of the site you quoted. Now you must consider that the “Family Trees” provided by loyal Muslims were not recorded by Muhammad or his forefathers, these family trees were formulated by his followers who came long after him. For example: When Muhammad was on the earth, both he and his contemporaries did not know his family tree. According to Islamic sources Muhammad was informed by an Angel about one of his ancestors, We are told: “Ma’n Ibn ‘Isa al-Ashja’i al-Qazzaz (silk-merchant) informed us; he said: Mu’awiyah Ibn Salih informed us on the authority of Yahya Ibn Jabir who had seen some Companions of the Prophet and said: The people of Banu Fuhayrah came to the Prophet and said to him: You belong to us. He replied: Verily, (the archangel) Gabriel has informed me that I belong to Mudar. (Ibn Sa’d, Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, Volume I, p. 4) Look here http://answering-islam.org/Shamoun/ishmael.htm So, here we have different family trees. Thanks for your info. I don’t disagree that Muslim commentaries teach that Ishmael is the forefather of Muhammad, I think I also mentioned Ali’s commentary.
In which Quranic verse does the Quran state that Abraham took Ishmael? If we consider the mothers [Sarah and Hagar] at no time was Ishmael the promised son even according to the Quran. The Quran is clear that the promised son was to be sacrificed. Muslims argue from the Bible that it was Ishmail and not Isaac. Their argue is taken incorrectly from their misinterpretation of who the only son was.
You wrote: “Even though you may think that a Hebrew+Egyptian do not make an Arab, it is quite possible that they can.” HOW? You can either take up the nationality of your father or mother or your guardian. Abraham was Hebrew, Hagar was Egyptian, therefore Ishmail was Hebrew for at lease his childhood until Isaac was born and Ishmail was kicked out. He went to Paran not to Arabia. You further said they travelled… Yes, but when did Abraham or Ishmael ever go to Arabia to settle there and to gain the title of being Arabs?
It is possible that Muhammad came from Ishmail but the evidence shows different. Remember, Muslims love Muhammad dearly.
Anyhow, God bless you my Christ-Loving sister, at lease, we won’t bomb one another when we differ on something, thanks God we are Christians.
Yours in Christ
Bro Michael Mahomed
December 14th, 2006 at 1:01 am
Hi All
I found this site of much use :
Links to Testimonies of Muslims who have become Christians:
IBRAHIM: http://www.answering-islam.org/Testimonies/ibrahim.html
ADEL: http://www.answering-islam.org/Testimonies/adel.html
SHEIKH MANSOUR: http://www.answering-islam.org/Testimonies/adel.html
SURAJ EL-DIN: http://www.answering-islam.org/Testimonies/suraj.html
MAHMOUD: http://www.arabicbible.com/testimonies/joseph_abraham.html
MA GABRIEL: http://www.arabicbible.com/testimonies/gabriel.htm
MASSRY: http://www.arabicbible.com/testimonies/massry_e.htm
HASSAN: http://www.arabicbible.com/testimonies/hassan.htm (AUDIO)
April 30th, 2007 at 3:53 am
its so funny westernised Muslim have no clue about true Islam, the are completely ignorant to the roots of it, they fail to see that religion is solely based on Arabic culture not truth. If Islam is the way to God everyone one this earth will have to be Arabianised. Islam is a waste of time because its not religion that gets u to heaven, ite not ur works, not how many times u pray, not how many times u fast, not how many times u go on a pilgrimage to mecca to see some black stone, we saved by the grace of God, because we as humans have fell away from the perfection of God and Fallible man can not work his way back by works, only God himself can bring us back to his perfection. Its only the precious blood of Jesus who is God in the flesh that can save (Ephesians 2, 8-9 for by grace are ye saved thru faith; and that not of urselfs; it is a gift of God:Not of works, lest any many should boast).
Think about it how can the muslim religion be for everyone, If I was to become a serious muslim I would have to change my whole persona and conform to that of an arabic person, if I went the mosque I wud wear an arabic tope, pray toward Arabia, probably have an Arabic name and speak the Arabic language, now imagine if everyone in the world was a muslim, the whole world would be one large arabia. Now for those who except Christ they come in to a relationship with God that is not about the exterior for those who worship God wordhip him in sprit and in truth not mechanical religion. I seriously advise all muslims to search for the truth and not just follow the relgion coz the are born in to it, the devil is a liar and he put religion here to confuse so I say search for the truth because when Judgement day comes and God says why didnt u expect me u have absolutely no excuse becuase the truth is out there its just up to you to seek it. Remember that Jesus died for the sins of everyman he didnt come to start relgion. RELIGION IS NOT OF GOD. Islam, is not of God,Hinduism is not of God, Buddism is not of God, Sikhism is not of God even Christianity is a title given by pagens. So step out of religion into relationship. GOD BLESS YOU
May 7th, 2007 at 4:01 am
Hello Stephanie, I am 15 years old as I write you this most humble comment, but first a bit about me!
I accepted Christ Jesus as my Saviour Great and Holy when I was 13 (that was in 2005). I can still remember the feeling of pure love from God that just completly washed over me as I accepted Him into my life forever. This was indeed a genuine feeling that I will never forget. It is kind of like the feeling I get when singing in my little church that I attend reguarly.
And now the comment!
I do take great pity on those of other religions (or those who are Anti-Religious) for did Jesus Himself not say: “I am the Way, I am the Truth, I am the Life. No-one comes to the Father but through Me. If you really knew Me, you would know the Father also. From now on, you do know Him and have seen Him”. (John 14:6)
Now what was Jesus Christ saying to His deciples then? Was He saying, (1)’There is NO OTHER way to salvation, but by me’ or (2)’You ARE indeed walking with God right now’ or (3)’I AM God’? Or mabey he was saying every single one of the above? I think so and quite frankly, this verse is the same one that had me to decide who to trust- No, not the teachings of Muhammed, not Buddha, not the hundreds of thousands of weak Hindu ‘gods’. Only He, Christ Jesus will I ever belive in. Amen.
And personally I think that the free Gift of God (which is the sacrifice of Christ) and the promise of Jesus Holy and True (salvation in His name) are the greatest comfort I could really hope for, EVER. Amen.
I know that by John 14:6 that Allah and the God of the Bible are NOT the same, I mean that in the sense that Muslims (according to Jesus Himself) DO NOT KNOW THE REAL GOD. And not just Muslims, but Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, Pagans and certainly Satanists do not truly know Him either, because if they did, they would not blindly stick to their false and blind teachings that in truth, hold no LOVE nor HOPE in a world destroying itself.
Praise the One, Powerful, Compassionate, Loving, Forgiving, Gracious God who, even though we were (are) sinners, sent his beloved Son, Jesus into the world to die in our place up on that cross in Jerusalem so that we could, by the loving will of God our Father, avoid the firey, painful death we as the Human Race deserve, to inherit Salvition and Everlasting Life with God.
All these things Jesus promises to us, and what a better reason to beleive in Him?
I say to all who read this: Go with God and God will go with you. Blessed is He who trusts in Jesus and sings of the Glory of God! Amen and Hallelujah! Hallelujah to the True God almighty!
If you want to find out more, why not go to your local church and ask the minister there to help you understand more. Read the Bible and develop an intimate relationship with God- it is His wish to have YOU in a relationship with Him. Amen and God Bless.
One last note:
“He said to me, “It is done. I am the aplha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To Him who is thirsty I will give to drink without cost from the spring of the water of life. He who overcomes shall inherit all this, and I will be his God, and he will be My son.” (Rev 21: Verses 6 and 7)
May 9th, 2007 at 6:14 am
Another thing the connection for the muslims to the bible is through Ishmael, again another thing muslims fail to realise is that Ismael is the father of the ARAB people not the muslims not all arabs are muslims are they but they are as much descendans of Ishmael as any muslim. Islam is again a religion that came from arabian people but u cant say that muslims came from the line of Ishmael, Arabs did muslims didnt. Again this whole culture and faith thing is strange to me, come people call Arabic culture, Islamic culture are they one in the same or what. I’m confused.
October 6th, 2007 at 5:44 am
Thank you for sharing!